Transcript [00:00] AMIR: Shalom, everyone, this is Amir Tsarfati from Behold Israel. [00:03] We're about to have a great interview with Dr Golan Broshi on the topic of "Who is a Jew?" "What is Judaism?" [00:12] "Is Christianity a new religion or is it actually a form of Judaism that existed already in the Second Temple period?" [00:21] And I chose to conduct this interview right here on the coastal plains of Israel, [00:27] the City of Netanya where the Mediterranean is meeting the land of Israel [00:32] because this is the meeting point of the Gentile world and the Jewish world throughout centuries. [00:38] And I think that it's interesting and important to maybe take a look at the Jewish people [00:45] and the Jewish Messiah and the gospel from the outside into the land of Israel. [00:57] Dr. Golan Broshi, what an honor to have you here with us today. [01:00] We've known each other for quite a few years. [01:02] DR. BROSHI: Bethsaida congregation. [01:04] AMIR: Bethsaida congregation, which I'm still part of but you moved to central Israel now and not in the north anymore. [01:10] And you are one of the professors in the Israel College of the Bible. [01:14] DR. BROSHI: Yes. [01:15] AMIR: And can you tell us a little bit about yourself. [01:17] DR. BROSHI: So yeah, it's a pleasure being here. [01:19] And I was born and raised in Kibbutz Malkiya up north, really ultra-atheistic, ultra-Communistic environment. [01:28] We slept in a kid's house, children's house because the kids would belong to the kibbutz. [01:34] The kids didn't belong to their parents. [01:36] But you know God can reach even the darkest places in the world. [01:40] And God sent an angel from Oregon, from America to witness. [01:47] But you know this angel was so naive. [01:51] You know how he witnessed to me; you know what he told me? [01:53] Nothing, but the way he acted, the way he behaved, I was overwhelmed. [01:58] I said, "What manner of man is he?" [02:00] AMIR: You're talking about a real person? [02:02] DR. BROSHI: A real person that came to volunteer in the kibbutz. [02:04] And he didn't witness with words but with his deeds. [02:08] But I was too stubborn. [02:10] I was too stupid, I guess, and I didn't catch it. [02:13] So God had to send another angel. This time from Korea. [02:17] You cannot go more Gentile than this, right? [02:18] AMIR: Yes. [02:19] DR. BROSHI: And again, what did this angel say? [02:22] Nothing, but I could see in her eyes the glory of the God of Israel, the glory of the salvation of Israel. [02:31] I saw it in her eyes. [02:32] And you know, long story short, we got married after Yeshua saved me. [02:37] We got married, we have a couple of kids, and we live close, close to this place, close to this hotel. [02:42] AMIR: Yes, and you graduated from the Haifa University. [02:46] DR. BROSHI: First Haifa University, then I went to the Hebrew University, and then I finished my doctorate in Dallas Theological Seminary, DTS. [02:53] And I serve as a teacher. [02:57] AMIR: Wonderful, and I know that recently you wrote a book that is being translated right now. [03:03] DR. BROSHI: Yes, "The Myth of the Oral Law." [03:06] It's in Hebrew (speaking Hebrew) and it's being translated as we speak to English. [03:12] AMIR: Wonderful! DR. BROSHI: So we could offer it in English. [03:15] AMIR: This is great, and you know the topic we're gonna talk about this morning here from the coastal City of Netanya [03:22] which is where the Israel College of the Bible is located is literally a topic that bothers millions around the world. [03:31] And unfortunately, it's also a tool in the hands of the enemy to confuse the people of God. [03:37] And that topic is: Who Are the Real Jews? [03:42] DR. BROSHI: And even more: Are There Any Real Jews? [03:45] So why would somebody say that there are no more Jews, and this is what we're gonna talk about. [03:51] But first we have to say: What is a Jew? Who's Israel? [03:56] AMIR: Who is a Jew? [03:57] DR. BROSHI: So we'll go to the most famous book in the world, the oldest book in the world, the Bible. [04:03] AMIR: Yes. [04:04] DR. BROSHI: And in the Bible, Israel appears hundreds if not thousands of times. [04:10] Israel in the Bible could be either the God of Israel or the physical descendant of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob. [04:18] AMIR: So the great question is: Are the Jews ethnos or ethos? [04:23] DR. BROSHI: So this is the main question. [04:26] Is Judaism a religion or Judaism is ethnic group like the Chinese like the Swedish? [04:32] So in the Bible in the Old Testament, we didn't go to the New Testament. [04:37] In the Old Testament Israel and the Jews are only physical descendant even if they don't keep the law. [04:45] AMIR: They're still Jews. [04:46] DR. BROSHI: So listen, now this is almost crazy. [04:48] Even if they don't keep Judaism -- let's say the Jewish law -- they're still Jews no matter what. [04:54] They could be secular, they could be... [04:56] AMIR: Because they were born Jew. [04:58] DR. BROSHI: Exactly, a Jew is somebody, and by the way, in the Bible, in the Old Testament, it's through the father. [05:04] AMIR: Absolutely. [05:04] DR. BROSHI: And we'll talk in a minute about conversion and about the mother thing. [05:10] But in the Bible, it's always through the father and we see it with Joseph. [05:15] Who did Joseph marry? [05:16] Asenath. [05:17] Asenath was an Egyptian. [05:19] Now according to the Talmud, every one of the kids of Jacob without Joseph -- Joseph married an Egyptian. [05:27] All the other kids of Jacob, the eleven married Canaanite women. [05:32] So they didn't marry Jewish women. [05:35] But their sons were still considered to be Jews -- [05:38] AMIR: Because it's the seed -- the seed is always from the father. [05:42] DR. BROSHI: From the father. [05:43] AMIR: So basically what you're saying is a descendant of a Jewish father automatically is a Jew. [05:54] DR. BROSHI: According to the Old Testament, that's the only -- AMIR: Even today. DR. BROSHI: -- criteria. [05:58] AMIR: No, I'm saying biblically. [06:01] DR. BROSHI: Biblically. [06:02] AMIR: Even today God never changed it. [06:04] DR. BROSHI: Exactly, God didn't change it. [06:06] The problem is that man messed with it. [06:09] But the term "Jewish people" could be surprising for some of us. [06:15] But the term "Jewish people" appears only in Jeremiah and in Esther. [06:20] Mordechai wasn't a descendant of Judah. [06:24] Mordechai wasn't from the tribe of Judah, but he's described as Mordechai the Jew because he came from Israel. [06:32] He was a descendant of Jacob. [06:34] So Mordechai is a Jew, not because he's Judean, [06:38] not because he came from the tribe of Judah necessarily -- actually from the tribe of Benjamin -- but he is a descendant of Jacob. [06:46] So we see it from Genesis to the Book of Esther, which is late. [06:50] From Genesis to Esther, a Jew is a descendant of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob. [06:55] AMIR: I see; Now we see today there's the term "a Jew" but there's also a term called "Judaism." [07:02] And Judaism everybody refers to as the religion of the Jews. [07:07] DR. BROSHI: Exactly; Now the question is: Where does the term "Judaism" appear first, and you wouldn't believe it. [07:14] But before that, how does the New Testament define a Jew? [07:18] AMIR: Okay, that's good. [07:19] DR. BROSHI: How does the New Testament define Israel? [07:21] So some of us could be surprised, but exactly as the Old Testament. [07:26] Exactly. [07:27] Now the term "Jews" appears in the New Testament over 100 times always referring to the physical descendants of Israel. [07:37] If they believe in Yeshua, if they reject Yeshua, if they follow the God of Israel, if they follow other gods, [07:43] the descendant of Israel are like it's in their blood. [07:47] It's in the DNA. [07:47] AMIR: It's a blood thing. DR. BROSHI: Exactly. [07:49] Jews are bloodline, exactly. [07:51] It doesn't matter what you believe. [07:53] It doesn't matter what you practice. [07:55] You don't necessarily follow the truth, but you don't stop being a Jew [08:00] because again, if we compare it to other ethnicities, how can the Chinese person stop being Chinese? [08:06] If he believes that or this, it doesn't matter, right? [08:09] You're Chinese because you're born Chinese, you cannot change it. [08:12] Now in the New Testament -- and this is why the problem starts. [08:17] - - In the New Testament there are other meanings for the term "Jews." [08:21] In the Gospel of John, the term "Jews" appears many times. [08:26] But there in the Gospel of John, sometimes the term "Jews" refer only to the Jewish leaders only. [08:33] AMIR: The leadership of the Jewish people. [08:35] DR. BROSHI: All the scholars agree, the religious Jews that rejected Yeshua are called Jewish, are called the Jews [08:42] because they come from Judea, from Jerusalem compared to the Galileans. [08:48] So let's take Simon Peter. He's a Galilean Jew. [08:52] AMIR: So sometimes in the Gospels when the term "Jews" [08:57] was mentioned, it wasn't necessarily talking about people not from Judea or not from leadership. [09:04] DR. BROSHI: Exactly, so when Yeshua is blaming the Jews in the Gospel of John, He's not blaming all the Jews. [09:11] When He says, "You are of your father, Satan," He's talking to specific Jews, the Pharisees. [09:17] The Pharisees is the priests and the scribes but mainly the scribes and the Pharisees which lived in Jerusalem. [09:24] They were Judeans compared to Simon that was Galilean. [09:29] But of course Simon was a Jew. [09:31] You know Sha'ūl, Paul the Apostle was a Jew, but he wasn't Judean because he wasn't born in Judea. [09:37] AMIR: Gotcha. So we see that in the New Testament there are two ways to refer to the Jewish people: [09:43] The descendants of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob. [09:45] DR. BROSHI: All the Jewish people. [09:46] AMIR: Yes, or the leadership that was religious and very, very into the law and all of that. [09:56] And so I wonder: The negative term "Jew" referred probably only to the leadership. [10:04] Exactly. [10:06] DR. BROSHI: So scholars find out every time the Jews are spoken negatively in the New Testament, it only refers to parts of the Jews. [10:16] And again, this is really important because the argument about the "True Way" is within Judaism. [10:24] Within the realm of Jewish people there's many cults, there's many Judaisms. [10:29] AMIR: Sub-streams. [10:30] DR. BROSHI: Exactly, streams, groups, there's the Essenes, the Pharisees, the Sadducees, the followers of Yeshua. [10:36] And the argument is within the family. [10:38] This is important to understand the argument of who is the true Jew in the sense of the spiritual Jew is within the realm of Judaism. [10:48] AMIR: Wow! That's huge what you just said! [10:51] What you just said is this: Because let's face it; A lot of Gentile believers believe they're the spiritual Israel [10:58] when He talks about who the real Jew is and all of that. [11:01] There's the spiritual and there's the physical. [11:03] But what you're saying is when the Gospels and the Epistles talk about the spiritual Jews [11:11] as well as the physical Jews, it was a Jewish discussion and arguments within themselves. [11:19] DR. BROSHI: Exactly. Within the Jews and we'll see it in... [11:21] AMIR: Some are spiritual and some are carnal. [11:24] DR. BROSHI: Exactly. AMIR: And some are religious. [11:25] DR. BROSHI: Listen, in Israel what's the percentage of secular Jews? [11:30] How many secular? [11:31] AMIR: Nowadays it's about 70%. [11:33] DR. BROSHI: 70%; Let's say 50%. [11:35] AMIR: Let's say 50. [11:36] DR. BROSHI: So are they Jews or not Jews? [11:37] AMIR: Of course they are. [11:38] DR. BROSHI: OF course they're Jews, but they're secular because of the Holocaust because of other things, they have forsaken God. [11:44] But they're Jews. [11:45] So now is there arguments in Israel? [11:48] AMIR: Of course. [11:49] DR. BROSHI: About politics, about... there's arguments like in every country. [11:53] And by the way, all the separation between the spiritual and physical, it's really dangerous because it goes to the Gnostic philosophy. [12:01] A man is a spirit and a body. [12:05] You don't separate Amir from his spirit. [12:07] The spirit needs your physical body, and your physical body needs your spirit. [12:11] So all this question: That's okay Israel is physical, but spiritual Israel is no... [12:16] AMIR: So what you're saying nation Israel is physical, but of the physical Israel, there were also the spiritual ones. [12:24] DR. BROSHI: So, Professor Boyarin, Professor Daniel Boyarin— I think he lives in America, he says, "Forget about Christianity and Judaism." [12:31] Forget about it. [12:31] In the first century, many Judaisms, many ways, many Judaism, Messianic Judaism, Rabbinic Judaism. [12:40] AMIR: But how will a non-Jew define himself? [12:43] DR. BROSHI: So a non-Jew was like -- [12:45] AMIR: Non-Jew believer? [12:46] DR. BROSHI: Yes, but listen, Boyarin says before the non-Jew, before the Gentile came to faith, [12:52] before that, in the time of the Gospels before any Gentile got saved, we had many forms of Judaism. [13:01] AMIR: So you're saying there is no Christianity within Judaism. [13:06] There was one more Jewish…group. [13:09] DR. BROSHI: Exactly, and not only one more, there's another professor from the Hebrew University [13:15] which says that the Messianic Judaism is before the rabbinic Judaism. [13:20] AMIR: Absolutely it is. [13:20] DR. BROSHI: Historically, it came before. [13:22] So listen, we have many Judaisms. [13:25] And the question is: Which one is the true Judaism? [13:28] The struggle in the first century Judaisms was: What is The Way? [13:33] Who has the authority from the Bible? [13:36] AMIR: What's the way, what's the truth and what's the life? [13:38] DR. BROSHI: Exactly. [13:39] AMIR: That why you have to tell them that. [13:40] DR. BROSHI: Exactly. And who has the authority over Israel? [13:43] The Pharisees? The priests? The Sadducees? [13:47] Who has the authority over the people? [13:50] Listen, the implication is huge because if Messianic Judaism is the true Judaism, and of course, we believe it is, [13:58] imagine... this is Judaism, Messianic, Christianity is Jewish. [14:04] AMIR: Christianity is actually the true Judaism, basically. [14:06] DR. BROSHI: And now you understand why this professor from the Hebrew University, Professor Yuval, [14:11] he has a whole book dedicated to the theme, the Christian roots of the rabbinic Jewish faith. [14:19] AMIR: Wow! [14:20] DR. BROSHI: The Christian roots -- so the Christian roots of the rabbinic faith -- [14:25] Every ceremony, holiday that we have in the rabbinic Judaism, he can find the origin in Messianic Judaism. [14:34] AMIR: But he called it Christian. [14:36] DR. BROSHI: He calls it Christianity, but he knows it's Jewish and he has an example. [14:42] The Seder, the Passover; He says the first Passover he can find is in the Gospels in The Last Supper. [14:50] Listen, this professor is a secular professor. [14:54] The first Seder, the first Passover historically as we know it today that the family is gathering and singing and eating [15:03] is found in the Last Supper in the Gospels not in the rabbinic literature that came 200 years later. [15:10] AMIR: So rabbinical literature cannot record a single time of a Passover Seder before the first century? [15:18] DR. BROSHI: Because the rabbinic literature is so late and the professor is a historian, so he says, "Wait, I'm going to check the writings. [15:27] If the writings of the New Testament come before the writings of the rabbis, I have to treat them as earlier." [15:34] So he's saying the first account of the Passover is in the New Testament. [15:40] Now the question is: We said Jews from the Old Testament and the New Testament, Jews are descendant of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob. [15:49] Okay, what about the rabbinic literature? [15:51] Who is a Jew concerning the rabbinic literature? [15:55] AMIR: There is the definition of who a Jew is according to the Bible. [15:59] DR. BROSHI: The Bible, the Old and New -- [16:00] AMIR: The Old and the New Testament which is the Word of God. [16:03] But you say the rabbinical Judaism offers a different definition to who a Jew is. [16:10] DR. BROSHI: Not only a different, a reformation which echoes to this day. [16:15] A huge reformation because rabbinic literature revolutionized the term "Jew" because they wanted to get the authority over Israel. [16:27] They said, "If you if you don't join our party, our political party, the Pharisees, if you don't join, your Judaism would be in risk, your Jewishness." [16:38] You could lose your Jewishness if you don't follow our type of Judaism. [16:43] AMIR: Actually the first people who actually said that Judaism is ethos rather than ethnos were Jews. [16:51] DR. BROSHI: Exactly. [16:52] AMIR: The rabbinical establishment. [16:53] DR. BROSHI: The rabbinic Jews are the first Jews in history which said that the Judaism is only a religion or is mainly a religion. [17:01] And if you don't follow our type of religion, our type of Judaism, the rabbinic Judaism, your Jewishness would be in risk. [17:08] This is a revolution, amazing revolution, and I want you to see a quote from the Talmud Tractate Megilla. [17:17] They ask, "Why did Mordechai from the Book of Esther, why was Mordechai called the Jew?" [17:24] Now the obvious question, we said the obvious question, the obvious answer, [17:27] Mordechai was called the Jew because he was a descendant of Jacob. [17:31] He was from the tribe. [17:32] The Talmud said, "No," the rabbi said, "No." [17:36] He was called a Jew because he—how do you say—(speaking Hebrew) He rejected pagan worship; he rejected idols. [17:48] So listen, according to this Tractate in the Talmud, Mordechai was called a Jew not because his physical origin, ethnic, [17:59] but because of ethos, because his theology was right! [18:03] AMIR: Wow! [18:04] DR. BROSHI: This is incredible! [18:06] This wouldn't pass anywhere in the world, anywhere in the world. [18:10] If you tried it on any other people in the world, any other group of people, it wouldn't work. [18:13] But the rabbi said Mordechai was called a Jew because he forsook pagan worship or other gods and stayed with the God of Israel. [18:24] AMIR: Wow! DR. BROSHI: This is incredible! [18:25] Now scholars are saying that the rabbis took it further. [18:30] If you deny Christianity, you are called a Jew. [18:35] If you deny Yeshua the Messiah, this is enough to call you a Jew. [18:43] So a really Jew, a true Jew is the one that rejected a certain theology, a certain belief. [18:50] AMIR: If you're a non-Christian, you're a Jew. [18:53] DR. BROSHI: Exactly. [18:55] Now this opens the door -- AMIR: I mean, that's the rabbinical. [18:57] DR. BROSHI: -- and listen, this opens the door for this reformation that we say that this is a change of Judaism from ethnos to ethos. [19:08] Now ethos is an idea, is a theology, is a religion. [19:11] Now this starts the confusion. [19:14] What is Judaism? [19:16] Is it a religion or is it an ethnic group? [19:20] What is Judaism? [19:21] The confusion starts only then. [19:23] AMIR: So our theme is: "Who are the real Jews?" [19:28] Going back to the Old Testament and New Testament a real Jew is anyone who is the descendant of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. [19:35] DR. BROSHI: Exactly. [19:36] AMIR: Now comes the rabbinical Judaism and then it says the real Jews are those who are: [19:42] A) They follow us in our traditions, our party. [19:47] B) As long as they're non-Christian. [19:49] DR. BROSHI: If they deny the enemy because listen, there's a political fight over the authority on the Bible. [19:57] And the Messianic Jews are growing, their population is growing, the rabbinic Jews are growing. [20:03] So they say, "As long as you reject them, you're with us." [20:06] But remember this is like political, and it's important to understand it's a family dispute within the family. [20:14] This is a family dispute over authority. [20:17] One amazing decision changed the Jewish world forever. [20:23] And we read it in the 15th chapter of Acts when -- [20:28] AMIR: Yes! I love that chapter; this chapter I'm quoting it all the time. [20:32] DR. BROSHI: Listen, the Jewish disciples of Yeshua don't know what to do because something which never happened before is happening now. [20:39] Gentiles are embracing the Messiah. [20:42] They're embracing the Jewish way, this kind of Judaism. [20:46] AMIR: And that's why it was a Jewish discussion, "What to do with the Gentiles?" [20:49] DR. BROSHI: The question arises, "What are we doing with the Gentiles?" [20:52] Now why? Because in the rabbinic party when Gentiles are joining, they're no longer Gentiles. [21:02] They’re "replacing" Israel so to speak by becoming Israel with conversion. [21:08] So they asked themselves, "Should the Gentiles that follow Yeshua convert like in the rabbinic party?" [21:17] AMIR: So I'm reading, "And certain men came down from Judea and taught the brethren, [21:22] "Unless you are circumcised according to the custom of Moses, you cannot be saved." [21:27] DR. BROSHI: Unless you convert, this is “giyur,” this is conversions, that's convert... [21:31] AMIR: Unless you convert -- DR. BROSHI: To Judaism. [21:33] AMIR: So you're basically the people who followed Paul didn't care about the soul or the spirit as much as of the flesh. [21:43] DR. BROSHI: And it says they were believing Jews in Yeshua that came from the Pharisees. [21:50] In their minds they said, "Wait a minute, the rabbis are converting Gentiles. [21:55] We should convert them too if they follow Christ. [21:58] If they follow that this kind of rabbinic Judaism, they convert. [22:02] So they should convert if they follow this kind of Judaism, which is the Messianic Judaism. [22:07] AMIR: So you're saying they are people who supposedly followed Christ but they had a twisted understanding? [22:13] DR. BROSHI: Exactly, because they came from a rabbinic background. AMIR: I see. [22:16] They were saved from rabbinic Judaism into Messianic Judaism and they say, "Fellas, let's convert them now." [22:21] AMIR: So this is why we know that Paul came all the way to Jerusalem. [22:25] And he says, "They were received by the church and the apostles and the elders; and they reported all things that God had done with them. [22:35] But some of the sect of the Pharisees..." DR. BROSHI: Exactly; what did they say? [22:40] AMIR: "Who believed rose up, saying, "It is necessary to circumcise them, and to command them to keep the law of Moses." [22:51] DR. BROSHI: To convert them, to make them Jews. [22:54] They said Gentiles must become Jews like the rabbis were doing. [22:58] AMIR: And you know up until today I see Gentiles that want to become Jews. [23:00] DR. BROSHI: And what is the answer? AMIR: And the answer was -- first of all, [23:03] "The apostles and the elders came together to consider the matter." [23:06] It was a big thing. [23:08] I'll talk all the way... I love Peter's speech because Peter was the first one. [23:14] He says, Guys, sorry. [23:15] He says with all the respect; he rose up and said to them, [23:19] "Men and brethren, you know that a good while ago God chose among us, that by my own mouth the Gentiles should hear the Word of the gospel and believe. [23:30] So God, who knows the heart, acknowledged them by giving them the Holy Spirit, just as He did to us, [23:38] and made no distinction between us and them, purifying their hearts by faith. [23:45] Now therefore, why do you test God by putting a yoke on the neck of the disciples which neither our fathers nor we were able to bear? [23:55] But we believe that through the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ we..". [23:59] look, now he's being -- I call it he was provoked to jealousy by them -- "we shall be saved in the same manner as they." [24:09] Isn't that interesting? [24:10] DR. BROSHI: So the resolution, the decision was the Gentiles that are embracing this Judaism, Messianic Judaism -- [24:17] AMIR: The decision in verse 19, yes. [24:18] DR. BROSHI: What does it say, 19? [24:20] AMIR: Okay, the decision. "Therefore I judge that we should not trouble those from among the Gentiles who are turning to God, but that we write to them [24:29] to abstain from things polluted by idols, sexual immorality, things strangled, and from blood." [24:36] That's it. [24:37] DR. BROSHI: They don't need -- AMIR: They don't come to be circumcised. [24:40] DR. BROSHI: They don't need to convert, they don't need to become Jews, and I'll tell you more. [24:44] They cannot become Jews. [24:45] How can the Chinese person that receives Yeshua can become Jew? [24:50] How can you become a Jew? [24:51] He can never become a descendant of Jacob. [24:53] AMIR: Exactly. [24:54] DR. BROSHI: He is a Jew maybe in the spirit that because he followed the spiritual Judaism, he followed the Christ. [25:00] AMIR: He's lacking the physical... [25:01] DR. BROSHI: He would never be physically Jew, but okay... [25:05] AMIR: He was grafted in. [25:06] DR. BROSHI: So we have that resolution with the disciples of Yeshua. [25:10] But disciples of the rabbis decided exactly the opposite. [25:14] Gentiles that would follow our way, the rabbinic way would have to convert. [25:21] They don't even have an option. [25:23] One group in Judaism, Messianic Judaism, is saying you don't need to convert. [25:27] The other group, the opposition is saying you must convert. [25:31] So now the implication is amazing because I'll ask you: What are more in the world, more Jews or more Gentiles? [25:40] AMIR: Absolutely Gentiles. [25:41] DR. BROSHI: Gentiles, so in a in a few years, if Gentiles are coming by thousands to the faith in Yeshua, [25:49] this movement is going to change demographically [25:52] because if in the beginning, there were more Jews, Messianic Jews, now after a few years, there would be more Gentile Jews. [25:59] AMIR: Which is that story. [26:00] DR. BROSHI: And it's the story till today; there's more Gentile followers of Yeshua. [26:05] So this religion appears to be Gentile because it's full of Gentiles, right, because there's more Gentiles, of course there's more Gentiles. [26:13] But what happened with the rabbinic camp? [26:15] In the rabbinic Judaism you have to “convert” to do Judaism, so every Gentile that embraced rabbinic Judaism became a Jew, so it grew. [26:27] So if Messianic Judaism shrank with the Jewish population -- AMIR: Rabbinical Judaism grew. [26:32] DR. BROSHI: Exactly, and this is what we have today. [26:34] AMIR: And not necessarily all by real Jews. [26:38] DR. BROSHI: Exactly, Rabbi Akiva wasn't a Jew. [26:41] Rabbi Meir, Shmaya Abtalion, all the big shots, all the hot shots in rabbinic Judaism some of them were not Jews physically. [26:52] They converted so they became Jews, if you could become -- [26:56] AMIR: They were converts. [26:57] DR. BROSHI: Exactly! And this is the key. [27:00] When the rabbis decided that they would go for conversion and invent conversion because we don't see it anywhere in the Old Testament, [27:09] we don't see it, we see it in the New Testament when Yeshua is rebuking them for doing it. [27:14] He says, "How can you convert Gentiles all over the world? You're making them sons of hell more than you." [27:19] You're sending them to hell because it's the wrong Judaism. [27:22] Yeshua is against conversion because how can you make a Swedish man become the descendants of Jacob? [27:31] How can you change his blood? [27:32] Now you're saying, "Wait, wait, wait, Golan, wait a minute. [27:35] The rabbis themselves, do they really believe in that conversion? [27:39] Do they really believe a Chinese person can become Jewish. [27:42] Come on you know it's nonsense, right?" [27:44] AMIR: Do they? [27:45] DR. BROSHI: So I'll tell you, so the Halakhah is the rabbinic law, the Mishneh. [27:49] The Halakhah is asking some questions. [27:53] Wait a minute. [27:54] A Chinese person "converted," became a Jew and he was an only son to his father. [28:01] Now his father is still Chinese. [28:04] His father is dead. [28:06] Who is entitled? [28:08] Is the son entitled for the inheritance of the father, yes or no? [28:13] Now why the question arose is because if he's Jewish, he's no more Chinese. [28:17] So does a Chinese person that converted entitled to inherit from his father after his father died? [28:25] And the answer in the Talmud is no because he's not Chinese anymore. [28:31] Not only that, a convert to Rabbinic Judaism is born-again. [28:36] AMIR: They used that term? [28:37] DR. BROSHI: The term is born-again as child is born-again. [28:43] As remember Yeshua said, "Unless you come as children and unless you're born from the spirit," born-again? [28:47] This is why Professor Yuval from the Hebrew University is saying there's so many parallels between the two movements [28:54] and he's saying the rabbis took the phrases from Messianic Judaism. [28:59] So a convert is born-again like a child and new to Judaism. [29:05] Now another question arose can -- and I'm sorry from being for being blunt. [29:10] AMIR: Yeah, go ahead. [29:11] DR. BROSHI: Can a Chinese person marry his Chinese sister? [29:16] And the Rambam says according to the Halakhah, he cannot marry his sister. [29:25] Why? [29:26] Because his sister is still Chinese. [29:28] She's a Gentile. [29:30] Unless she converts, he cannot marry her. [29:33] AMIR: And if she converts? [29:34] DR. BROSHI: if she converts according to rabbinic law, they are not brother and sister, so he can marry her. [29:41] This is just to say that at least the rabbis believed this conversion. [29:46] It wasn't only a fiction, okay, we'll accept those Gentiles. [29:52] And look, Rabbi Akiva wasn't a Jew. [29:54] He married Rachel. [29:56] He married a Jewish girl and his descendants are Jewish. [29:59] No question about it. [30:01] Nobody, nobody -- you know even today if you ask people in the streets, [30:05] "Hey who's the most famous rabbinic Jew in the world?" [30:08] "Oh, Rabbi Akiva, probably." [30:11] He wasn't even a Jew, but because his parents converted, now he's a "physical" Jew. [30:18] AMIR: Interesting. [30:20] DR. BROSHI: Can you see more replacement theology than this? [30:22] AMIR: I know, but it's interesting Golan; I tell you why. [30:26] Satan knows who the real Jews are. [30:29] DR. BROSHI: And he came to confuse, right? [30:31] AMIR: Yes, but he knows that if he wants to get rid of the Jews, he needs to tell the enemies of Israel. [30:39] Let's say, Hitler, Hitler didn't look for religious Jews. [30:43] He didn't look for rabbis or rabbinical -- DR. BROSHI: He didn't care. [30:46] AMIR: Hitler did think that it's an Ethnos. [30:49] DR. BROSHI: Exactly. [30:50] AMIR: Because he went after every person with Jewish blood. [30:53] DR. BROSHI: Because he knew that if you take down the ethnicity, the ethnic Jews, you take down Judaism. [31:00] AMIR: Yes. [31:01] DR. BROSHI: You know, take the physical first, the spiritual will die later, you know what I mean? [31:07] Most of the anti-Semites; who do they attack? The spiritual Jews? The spiritual Israel? [31:13] They would never take spiritual. [31:14] They think they're the spiritual Israel. [31:16] So they would always attack physical Israel, which tells you that all this nonsense about are there any real Jews, if there is an anti-Semite, they're real Jews. [31:27] AMIR: It's interesting, you're right, you're right. [31:29] They first they say there are no more real Jews and then they blame the Jews for all the problems. [31:34] DR. BROSHI: For everything. [31:34] You have to decide which end of the stick... [31:36] AMIR: Yeah. [31:37] DR. BROSHI: But you know there's another professor, Yirmiyahu Yovel, [31:40] he comes today, and he says, "Wait a minute, wait a minute, you're going crazy! [31:46] Judaism became a religion?" [31:49] He says, "Wait a minute, if Judaism became religion, which religion is it? [31:56] Is it reformed Judaism? [31:58] Is it conservative? [31:59] Is it orthodox? [32:00] What about the secular Jews? [32:02] If Judaism is only a religion, what about the millions of secular Jews all around the world?" [32:08] So he says, "Of course this is nonsense. [32:10] Of course Judaism is not only a religion and is not a religion from the beginning. [32:15] But on the other hand, Professor Yirmiyahu Yovel asking: If Judaism is only an ethnic thing, we have another problem. [32:26] What about all the conversions, all the converts, all the thousands of converts that came from the time of Yeshua till today? [32:33] Yirmiyahu Yovel, this professor is asking if Judaism is only ethnicity, what do we do with all the converts now? [32:41] What do we do with Rabbi Akiva? [32:43] We're throw him under the bus, what are we going to do with him? [32:46] And this question of who is the Jew is still haunting the Jewish world. [32:50] It's still a family dispute like in the first century in Israel. [32:56] In the highest courts, there's still in the Supreme Court the question "Who is the Jew?" [33:01] Now I'll tell you what happened. [33:03] This confusion influence the secular state of Israel with the Law of Return. [33:09] Everybody knows the Law of Return the law that gives permission Jews everywhere in the world to make Aliyah, to come to Israel. [33:15] AMIR: By definition, Israel was declared as a Jewish state, a state for the Jews. [33:18] DR. BROSHI: So in the '50s of the former century, 1950, there was a law passed. [33:25] Every Jew in the world can make Aliyah, can come to Israel to live in Israel and will be a citizen of Israel, every Jew. [33:33] Now in the '70s, the rabbinic and religious parties said that way, that's not good enough. [33:39] That's not good enough because we want to decide who is a Jew. [33:43] So by the force of political religious parties, the Law of Return was changed, was fixed. [33:51] We call it a tikkun, a fix to the law, and they define it for the first time in the world. [33:56] Jews define it; who is the Jew? [34:00] And there's three criteria: first you got to be born of a Jewish mother which is incredible because in the Bible it was a Jewish father. [34:11] So there's a Jewish mother. [34:13] AMIR: And by the way, when did that change? [34:15] DR. BROSHI: In the Talmud they decided -- [34:18] AMIR: Was it because the Roman soldiers? [34:20] DR. BROSHI: They would attribute it, and it's a good point what you said, [34:23] they attributed to Ezra but it's out of context, the reading of Ezra, so we live Ezra aside. [34:29] But the rabbis contributed this reformation which makes Jews only by their mother being Jewish. [34:36] They attribute it to Ezra, but actually it's in the Talmud. [34:39] But scholars are saying this is from the influence of the Greek, excuse me, from the Romans [34:45] because the Romans in the laws they had something with the mother with being a Roman citizen, something with the mother. [34:53] So scholars are saying the rabbis took it or had influence from the Roman law. [34:58] But the first criteria was a Jewish Mother. [35:03] The second is if you converted, which is amazing. [35:06] AMIR: So a Gentile who converted? [35:08] DR. BROSHI: A Gentile which converts to rabbinic Judaism can come, can make Aliyah. [35:13] And the third one, which is the most revolution one, if you're not a part of a different religion. [35:20] So if Amir embraces different Judaism other than rabbinic Judaism, Amir is not a longer a Jew. [35:30] AMIR: Not a Jew for the sake of the Law of Return. [35:33] If he is not in Israel and he wants to move to Israel, they will not recognize him as a Jew if he is holding a belief in Yeshua. [35:40] DR. BROSHI: And this is the strongest mix, mixing religion and ethnicity. [35:47] Can you imagine that your faith would determine your ethnicity? [35:51] Would it apply anywhere in the world? [35:54] AMIR: Absolutely not. [35:55] DR. BROSHI: This is incredible! [35:56] AMIR: A question that I have to you is how did the destruction of the Second Temple in Jerusalem reshape the Judaism as it is today? [36:08] DR. BROSHI: This is one of the most important questions of our discussion. [36:13] Because in the year 70 when the temple was destroyed, biblical Judaism was destroyed with it. [36:21] I say again biblical Judaism, biblical, and I mean biblical, the Sinai... based on the priests, on the temple, on the sacrifices that was destroyed with the temple. [36:35] And now a New Testament had to come, some kind of a New Testament because the Old Testament -- [36:42] AMIR: Which by the way was promised. [36:43] DR. BROSHI: It was promised. [36:44] Now listen we know there's many parties in the Jewish world and each one of them is so-called "bringing a New Testament" [36:53] because all of them recognized when the temple was destroyed, the Old Testament Judaism was destroyed with it [37:01] because the priest did not have any more place to work, there were no longer sacrifices, no place of worship anymore. [37:08] Biblical Judaism was destroyed and another Judaism and New Testament. A New Covenant had to come. [37:14] AMIR: From the ashes of the Temple a new one rose. [37:18] DR. BROSHI: Now the question is which New Testament is the real one, [37:22] the rabbinic New Testament of the oral law or the Messianic New Testament by the blood of Yeshua? [37:28] But every Jew knew that now something new has to come, a New Testament has to come because the Sinai you cannot keep. [37:38] The Sinai Covenant is based on sacrificial work by the priest only and only in one place where God chooses in Jerusalem. [37:47] So listen; now in the second century, most Jews are gone from the country. [37:53] They're in Babylon and in Europe. [37:55] So there is no longer even the land of Israel, nor the temple. [37:59] AMIR: So there's no temple, there's no Jerusalem, there is no land of Israel. [38:03] DR. BROSHI: Exactly, and now a New Testament has to come. [38:06] So in that sense, rabbinic Judaism offers the New Testament and Messianic Judaism offers a New Testament. [38:13] And Jews and Gentiles have to decide which New Testament is the true, the one that was expected by the prophets, was foretold by the prophets. [38:25] Which New Testament, but it has to be new because nobody today, nobody in Israel, nobody in the world keeps the Sinai covenant, nobody. [38:35] You can't; how can you? [38:37] Now people are saying, "Wait a minute, aren't rebuilding the Third Temple?" [38:41] Yes, but in the Third Temple there would only be thanks, korban todah, only thanksgiving sacrifice. [38:49] So the sins had to be atoned by another means. [38:54] Now listen; Yeshua said He's the atonement for sins. [38:58] Yeshua in the New Testament of the Messianic Judaism, Yeshua said, "I'm the atonement." [39:03] In rabbinic Judaism, they said, "Wise disciples which studied the oral law, they are the atonement for Israel." [39:11] So we see; listen, listen., now you understand why Professor Yuval -- [39:16] AMIR: Now I understand why they confuse Isaiah 53. [39:18] DR. BROSHI: Exactly, and you see why Professor Yuval is saying that this is so similar, rabbinical and Messianic Judaism are so similar. [39:25] Because in Messianic Judaism, Yeshua is saying I'm gonna make sacrifices -- [39:29] AMIR: I'm the ultimate sacrifice. [39:30] DR. BROSHI: For Israel; I'm gonna make atonement. [39:33] And Rabbinic party, the rabbinic Judaism says the wise disciples that are studying as we speak in the yeshiva, they are the true atonement. [39:41] It says in Midrash Avot de-Rabbi Natan -- it says they are the true atonement for Israel. [39:48] Can you imagine that? [39:49] So you have to pick: Is Yeshua gonna be your atonement or the wise disciples? [39:55] Now how did the rabbis make their Judaism so popular? [40:00] How did you make somebody become a Jew? [40:04] There's two ways. [40:06] If he's Jewish, you have to convert him from secularism or whatever Judaism he practices, you have to convert him to rabbinic Jew. [40:15] That's how you make him a real Jew. [40:18] But there's also what the scholars are saying, mission, outside mission, outside the Jewish world mission, [40:24] missionary work to make the Gentile Jewish by conversion. [40:30] So some rabbinic Judaism going with the two-edged sword: Inside the Jewish world we'll make converts, [40:38] and outside the Jewish world we'll make converts from the Gentile but it's both conversion. [40:44] You're converting from secularism Judaism and you're converting from being Gentile into Judaism. [40:51] AMIR: I will be very honest with you. [40:52] You know me; I'm shooting straight. [40:54] Where we go now is the punch line, the deep water. [40:59] And in this whole thing I think it was -- first of all, it was an amazing wealth of information that everybody could understand. [41:07] I think that the understanding that there's an internal dispute within the Jews, a discussion that people take out of context, this is amazing. [41:17] But I want to tell you something. [41:20] And I know that thousands and thousands, hundreds of thousands of our followers know exactly my opinion about [41:27] people who are spewing two to three verses from the New Testament that sounds very bad, and they make it look as if the New Testament is anti-Semite, [41:44] therefore they have the justification to be anti-Semite and Christians at the same time. [41:50] And let's deal with those verses and let's ask ourselves can, or is the New Testament an anti-Semitic book? [42:02] DR. BROSHI: So only this question alone: Is the New Testament anti-Semite? [42:07] It's an oxymoron. [42:08] It is like is the ice warm? [42:11] Which New Testament, The rabbinical New Testament? [42:13] Nobody would dare say the rabbinic New Testament is anti-Semite, right? [42:17] But which New Testament are you talking about? [42:19] Remember, there's several New Testaments. [42:21] Oh, so you're talking about this New Testament? Is this New Testament...why? [42:26] Because there's a few harsh verses? [42:28] When Yeshua is talking to His fellow Jews? [42:31] If I took Isaiah, the first chapter when Isaiah is calling them vipers, would somebody accuse Isaiah of being anti-Semite? [42:39] What are you; are you out of your mind? [42:41] AMIR: It's anti-religion. [42:42] DR. BROSHI: This is incredible! [42:43] We said there's a family dispute; there's a dispute with Israel today, [42:48] even today politically-wise, religiously-wise, there's a discussion in Judaism, in Israel. [42:55] What is The Way? what is the True Way in politics, in religion? [42:58] There's a discussion among Jews. [43:01] Let us discuss. [43:02] Let us do it; we don't need -- you know you can support us, but let us discuss it, let us convince our Jewish fellow, our Jewish men with the truth. [43:13] But it's a Jewish discussion. [43:15] Now I know there's a few harsh versus. [43:18] AMIR: Let's read John 8:44. [43:20] DR. BROSHI: But I just want to remind people there's also versus in the Old Testament. [43:24] AMIR: Absolutely. I agree with you. [43:27] DR. BROSHI: But why would nobody dare? [43:28] Because they think that “Well, the Old Testament is Jewish, the Old Testament is Judaism.” [43:32] Wait a minute. [43:33] Who wrote the New Testament if not the Jewish fellas, followers of Yeshua? [43:38] Why do you call the New Testament anti-Jewish? [43:40] How could it be anti-Jewish if it's Jewish altogether, and the most Jewish figure, the hero of it is Yeshua? [43:47] AMIR: Absolutely, and how can both of us as Jews, as Israeli-born could come to faith in Yeshua if this book was so anti-Semitic? [43:56] DR. BROSHI: But this is the lie that they sell us. [43:58] And then when we open the Gospel, we say what? [44:01] This book's supposed to be anti-Semite? This is the most Jewish book in the world. [44:05] Why did you hide us from this? [44:07] AMIR: Yes, so let's go to John 8:44. [44:11] Jesus is speaking to the Pharisees. [44:13] He's speaking to the leaders and he's saying -- DR. BROSHI: And some of them are His disciples, some of them follow Him. [44:19] Remember some of the Pharisees are following Him. [44:22] AMIR: So He said, "You belong to your father, the devil, and you want to carry out your father's desires." [44:29] DR. BROSHI: Now that sounds pretty hard, right? [44:32] AMIR: It's very harsh, but Golan, I must tell you that sounds familiar to me. [44:38] DR. BROSHI: Amir, Amir, tell me: Is there is there an election going on in America in a few months? [44:42] AMIR: There is. [44:43] DR. BROSHI: Are the opponent's attacking one another? [44:46] AMIR: Yes. [44:46] DR. BROSHI: They're taking one another, are they still Americans? [44:48] AMIR: They're still Americans. [44:49] DR. BROSHI: There's no anti-American, at least none of them think he is anti-American, right? [44:53] AMIR: Well, both of them claim to be the true American. [44:57] DR. BROSHI: But they can attack each other in an American dispute and none of them is thinking he's not American, right? [45:05] So there's a dispute here. [45:06] Yeshua is disputing another sect. [45:09] And by the way He's calling them, "You are from your father, Satan." [45:14] Did He call one of His disciples Satan? [45:17] AMIR: Yeah, it's interesting, it's interesting. [45:18] I'm looking at Matthew 16, it's obviously Caesarea Philippi when Peter first acknowledged Jesus as the Christ, the Son of the living God. [45:28] And then Peter rebukes Jesus for talking about His soon death, and Jesus turned and said to Peter, "Get behind me, Satan. [45:37] You're a stumbling block to me, and you do not have in mind the concerns of God but merely human consent." [45:44] DR. BROSHI: So listen, listen, Yeshua is calling one of His -- can you tell me of one Christian that would dare to say that Saint Peter is anti-Semite, or of Satan himself? [45:56] Can you show me one Christian that would do that? [46:00] But when Yeshua is talking to other Jews who don't believe yet, then it's anti-Semite. [46:05] Oh, come on. [46:06] AMIR: I know it's weak and I know it's -- excuse me for my French -- stupid, but I mean that's how they take it. [46:12] Dr. Broshi: But listen, don't take our word. [46:14] John MacArthur, not a Jewish believer, John MacArthur from California, he wrote a commentary. [46:20] He's saying what Yeshua is meaning is that He's talking to Jews in the flesh. [46:26] He means that they're not Jews in the spirit. [46:29] Remember dispute? What's the real spiritual way for Jews? [46:34] So Yeshua is telling them, "I know, I recognize that you're Jews in the flesh." [46:39] But even MacArthur said calling them :sons of Satan" means they're not walking in the spiritual Judaism. [46:46] They're not Jews in the spirit. [46:48] That's the meaning of this verse in John. [46:51] AMIR: And you know it's funny because, Golan, the Bible says, and I'm just reminded that right now, [46:58] I think everybody would probably appreciate, everybody knows John 3:16. [47:02] We always quote that, but watch this. [47:05] He says in John 3:17 -- he says in 17, [47:09] "For God did not send His son into the world to condemn the world, but that the world through Him might be saved." [47:16] And then he says in 18, "He who believes in Him is not condemned, but he who does not believe is condemned already." [47:24] DR. BROSHI: Exactly. [47:25] AMIR: In other words, whether you're a Jew or non-Jew, if you're not believing in Christ, you're condemned already. [47:32] And that is obviously -- [47:33] DR. BROSHI: Now what did Yeshua tell his disciples ? [47:35] I did not come to the Gentiles; I came to the lost sheep of the House of Israel. [47:39] So of course the dispute is gonna be between Jews. [47:42] Because Yeshua didn't argue with Gentiles. [47:46] He argued with his fellow man. [47:47] AMIR: And now comes the big "However." [47:49] There are times, twice in the Book of Revelation Chapter 2 and Chapter 3, verse 9 in both of them [47:59] where we hear of people who claim to be Jews but they're nothing but the synagogue of Satan. [48:06] DR. BROSHI: This is what you're hearing today. [48:08] AMIR: Absolutely. [48:10] DR. BROSHI: In the social media. [48:11] AMIR: Those anti-Semites today call the Jews, the real Jews, the synagogue of Satan. [48:17] DR. BROSHI: Something about anti-Semites. [48:18] They they're already anti-Semites, they just need an excuse you know like Haman, like Pharaoh, like the one from Germany that I don't want to remind his name also, [48:27] but they just need an excuse. [48:29] So if you hate the Jews, you're gonna find anything. [48:32] AMIR: You will hang on any verses you want. [48:34] DR. BROSHI: Even the verses that you want to say about it from Revelation, even if they did not exist, they would find something else if they're anti-Semites, right? [48:40] AMIR: That's right; I agree with you. [48:42] DR. BROSHI: They just need an excuse. [48:43] AMIR: So in Chapter 2, the letter, of course in Chapter 2, I'm talking about the church of Ephesus. [48:51] DR. BROSHI: So who are the letters to? [48:52] AMIR: To the churches! DR. BROSHI: To the churches! [48:54] AMIR: To the Gentiles, and then look what He says. [48:56] He's talking to the churches and it has to be clear to the people. [49:00] This is not -- in both Chapter 2:9 and Chapter 3:9, we're not talking about a condemnation for Israel or to Israel. [49:09] This is about people who claim to be -- [49:12] DR. BROSHI: He's not talking to physical Jews anymore, that's not the point. [49:16] AMIR: Here it says, and let's read it. [49:18] He says, "I know your affliction and your poverty, yet you are rich." [49:23] And then He says, "I know about the slander of those who say they are Jews and are not, but are a synagogue of Satan." [49:30] And then in Chapter 3 -- I'm not afraid to read those verses because I know how deceptive people can be. [49:38] Now I'm talking about the letter to the church in Philadelphia. [49:44] Look what he says. [49:45] And he says this: "Indeed, I will make those of the synagogue of Satan who say they are Jews and are not, but lie -- [49:55] indeed I will make them come and worship before your feet and to know that I have loved you. [50:01] So let's now remember that's the Roman Empire. [50:06] This is the first century. [50:08] These are churches in Asia Minor and now we're talking about the letters to the leaders those churches regarding certain people who claimed to be Jews. [50:21] They are not really Jews, but actually synagogue of Satan. [50:24] DR. BROSHI: Now historians, Bible scholars that study history and context are saying [50:31] because Yeshua is speaking to non-Jews or congregation that consists of mostly non-Jews, [50:37] why is He saying that there are some people who are calling themselves Jews and are not Jews? [50:43] How can they call themselves Jews but they're not real Jews, but why would they do it? [50:47] So the scholars are saying the Romans, the pagan Romans used to worship the emperor like a God. AMIR: Are you talking about Caesar? [50:55] DR. BROSHI: Yes, Caesar, like a god. [50:57] So he's saying they called themselves Jews, meaning following the true God, [51:02] as if those pathetic Messianic Gentiles and Jews, they're wrong, they're nothing. [51:08] AMIR: Yeah, they follow the one that we crucified. DR. BROSHI: Yeah, they follow the crucified... [51:11] And the Romans, they're saying, "We follow the true God, Caesar. We’re the "true Jews." [51:17] So Jews in this sense is a compliment, is "we follow the true”… [51:21] AMIR: But they're not! [51:23] DR. BROSHI: But they're not Jews, they're not real Jews. [51:25] 1) Because they're Romans and then they followed Caesar. [51:31] They see Caesar as god. [51:33] So of course they're not Jews, but it doesn't have to do anything with real Jews. [51:39] AMIR: Isn't that interesting, Golan? [51:41] You know I totally accept this, but I think that if we take, obviously, the Bible is also true today [51:49] and this is the Book of Revelation, which means most of the book speaks of the future, not of the past, [51:56] and I… [51:57] DR. BROSHI: So I wonder are there any Christians that they're calling themselves Jews but they're not really Jews? [52:03] AMIR: Absolutely. DR. BROSHI: Can this happen? [52:05] AMIR: I believe -- DR. BROSHI: Can history repeat itself? AMIR: -- and I'm sorry if I'm offending people right now but it has to be said. [52:11] And I know I'm going to be attacked for it, but so be it. [52:15] I believe that any Christian who claims to be the true Israel and that he had replaced Israel and now he is Israel, namely replacement theology, [52:29] I believe this is satanic, diabolic, and I believe -- DR. BROSHI: We need to pray for them. [52:35] AMIR: Yes, yes, we need to pray for them. [52:37] But I believe that this is a synagogue of Satan. [52:41] And you know so many times I meet Gentiles who are keeping the law, who are trying to become more Jews than the Jews, [52:49] and then they accuse those that are saved by grace as if they're not Christians. [52:55] DR. BROSHI: I have good news for these Gentiles, and I go back to Acts, the 15th chapter. [53:00] You don't have to become Jewish. [53:02] This is no rabbinic Judaism, we don't force, Yeshua doesn't force anybody. [53:07] AMIR: I strong agree with you. DR. BROSHI: This is good news for you, you can still be Chinese. [53:11] You don't have to become Israel, you cannot become Israel. [53:14] You embrace Israel's faith. [53:15] You join the team you can embrace the Jewish faith without becoming Jewish. [53:21] AMIR: You know I want to end up this with a personal angle. [53:26] It's a personal angle about our wives. DR. BROSHI: Our wives. [53:29] AMIR: Yes, our wives. Let's face it; our wives are a reflection, of this confusion a mirror reflection of everything we just talked about. [53:36] DR. BROSHI: And it's a paradox; listen, my wife is Korean. [53:39] I said you cannot go more Gentile than this, I'm sorry, this is the end of the world. [53:44] Okay, my wife converted in an Orthodox conversion so legally, legally my wife for the rabbinic perspective is Jewish. [53:53] My wife is legally Jewish. [53:54] They turned that she's no longer Korean; she's Jewish. [53:57] Now your wife. [53:58] AMIR: My wife; her father is a Jew. [54:02] DR. BROSHI: So biblically she's Jewish. [54:03] AMIR: Descendant of Holocaust survivors. [54:07] My wife was born in Denmark to a Jewish father of a Holocaust-surviving parent and to a Gentile born-again Christian mother. [54:18] Now watch this, Golan. [54:20] My wife that has a Jewish father, the blood is considered by the rabbinical Jews as non-Jew. [54:28] And your wife that has no Jewish blood is considered a full-blown Jew. [54:33] DR. BROSHI: Exactly. Why? Because she passed the theological test. [54:37] And his is an example for the -- if nobody understood a word we said until now, this is an example for the confusion between mixing oil and water, [54:45] mixing religion with blood and ethnicity. [54:49] You know my wife is a Gentile but is considered to be Jewish because she passed the test, the theological test. [54:54] Your wife is Jewish by ethnicity, but she's considered to be Gentile because she didn't pass the test. [54:59] AMIR: Yes, isn't that crazy? [55:01] But I want to tell you, and we will conclude here, I want to tell you this. [55:04] My children and your children, my wife and your wife, my family and your family; it doesn't matter where you come from, it matters where you go to. [55:17] DR. BROSHI: Exactly, concerning salvation, there's only one way. [55:21] AMIR: Absolutely. [55:22] I want to conclude this in the Book of Acts in the last chapter, Chapter 28 in the Book of Acts, verse 17. [55:29] "And it came to pass after three days that Paul called the leaders of the Jews together. [55:33] And so when they had come together, he said to them: Men and brethren, though I have done nothing against our people or the customs of our fathers, [55:45] yet I was delivered as a prisoner from Jerusalem into the hands of the Romans, who when they had examined me, [55:50] wanted to let me go because there was no cause to put me to death." [55:54] "But when the Jews" -- here he is talking about the leaders from Judea -- [55:58] "But when the Jews spoke against it, I was compelled to appeal to Caesar, not that I had anything of which to accuse my nation," he says. [56:08] "For this reason therefore I have called for you, to see you and speak with you because for the hope of Israel, I am bound with this chain." [56:19] Jesus is the hope of Israel. [56:21] DR. BROSHI: Amen, and the King of the Jews. [56:23] And it's good that you mentioned that, I want you to read one more verse from 1 Thessalonians because that's another Jew haters always want to use. [56:32] 1 Thessalonians Chapter 2:14 and 15. [56:37] AMIR: Okay, so here I am, I'm reading it, 14 and 15. [56:41] He says, "For you, Brethren, became in imitators of the churches of God which are in Judea in Christ Jesus. [56:50] For you also suffered the same things from your own countrymen just as they did from the Judeans, [56:56] who killed both the Lord Jesus and their own prophets, and have persecuted us. [57:03] And they do not please God and are contrary to all men." [57:09] DR. BROSHI: Exactly, now in some translations, the "Judean" is "Jews," and they don't understand. [57:15] And MacArthur is emphasizing this in his commentary. [57:18] It's not Jews in a whole; its's Judean, it's the one who persecuted. [57:24] It's the rabbinic cult that persecuted Sha'ūl. And so again, it's a family dispute between two New Testaments to this day. [57:32] AMIR: We will conclude now. [57:34] Real Jews still exist. [57:38] DR. BROSHI: Amen. [57:39] AMIR: They never disappeared. [57:41] God has a plan. [57:43] DR. BROSHI: And God promised they would never disappear. [57:44] AMIR: God promised, God has a plan for them. [57:47] God brought them back to their land, miraculously. [57:50] God restored the land for them. [57:51] DR. BROSHI: Got them back despite -- in Ezekiel 36 it says that in spite of their sin, He didn't forsake them. [58:01] AMIR: And then we see that He restored the land, restored the language, restored the everything around here, [58:08] and both of us are the real proof that Israel still exists, Jews are back in the land. [58:21] I wanna tell you folks the God of Israel is faithful. [58:25] And if He forgot about Israel or replaced Israel or got rid of Israel, then how can you be so sure He won't do it to you? [58:33] I mean the faithfulness of God to Israel is an insurance policy to the Gentiles that He will keep His covenant. [58:42] DR. BROSHI: And by the way, God was faithful to Israel through their sin, while they were yet sinners. [58:46] How did He save us, Gentiles and Jews? AMIR: While we were yet sinners. DR. BROSHI: Exactly, same pattern, Amen. [58:54] AMIR: Thank you. [58:55] God bless you, and say hi to Sue, to your wife and to your kids. [59:00] And this is it. [59:02] And I want to thank you all for praying for this ministry. [59:05] And I want to remind you: If you hate that which God loves, you'll end up loving that which God hates, God bless you. [59:14] (Music playing)
