Transcript [00:00] [music] [00:02] life audio [00:04] >> on today's episode of Timeless Wisdom. [00:08] >> That's what has always boggled me about [00:11] these arguments with God. I mean, if God [00:14] is really God, who am I to argue? And [00:16] yet, for some reason that I cannot [00:19] understand because I never met God like [00:21] this. It doesn't answer that they're [00:24] certain of God. I mean, to Moses, the [00:27] idea of atheism would be ludicrous. He [00:29] that would he would be denying his own [00:30] experience. Right? So it's not a [00:33] question that there's that atheism is [00:35] possible. [00:37] But there are questions. All right. [00:38] You're God. [00:41] What is your nature? See that's why [00:43] ladies and gentlemen, we ask wrong [00:46] questions a lot of times. And that's why [00:49] a lot of people are theologically [00:50] confused. People say, for example, I [00:53] can't believe in God after the [00:54] Holocaust. That to me doesn't make [00:57] sense. What makes sense is to say I [01:00] don't understand God or I don't love [01:03] God. [01:05] That makes sense to me. [01:08] The issue with God is really I we don't [01:11] understand how a good God has a world of [01:15] such horror. That's coming up on [01:17] Timeless Wisdom with Dennis Prager. [01:20] >> When someone you love is hurting, what [01:22] do you do? We're often quick to say, "If [01:24] there's [music] anything I can do, just [01:26] let me know." But what if we stopped [01:28] waiting to be asked and simply showed [01:30] up? On the If There Is [music] Anything [01:32] I Can Do podcast, Pam McConnell shares [01:35] real stories, biblical wisdom, and [01:37] practical ways to walk [music] alongside [01:39] people through grief, loss, and life's [01:41] hardest moments. Learn how to show up [01:43] and make a difference. Subscribe now at [01:45] kovepodcast.com, [01:47] YouTube, [music] or wherever you listen [01:49] to podcasts. [01:51] >> Welcome to Timeless Wisdom with [music] [01:54] Dennis Prager. Here thousands of hours [01:56] of Dennis's lectures, courses, and [01:58] classic [music] radio programs. And to [02:00] purchase Dennis Prager's rational [02:01] Bibles, go to dennisprager.com. [music] [02:05] >> Can't think of anything better to do on [02:07] Halloween than study the Torah. I mean, [02:09] it is like the juxiposition is to me uh [02:13] wonderful. And uh I'm glad we're here [02:17] together. All right, my friends. We're [02:20] up to Exodus 5. [02:23] All right. Now you recall Moses and [02:26] Aaron have met the elders, told them [02:28] Moses has spoken about how God has [02:31] appeared to him, told him what he must [02:33] do and that he has been sent and he [02:35] gives this the miraculous signs and then [02:39] uh they uh they believe in him. The uh [02:41] the Jews, the Israelites believe in him. [02:45] And uh we go now to Exodus 5. [02:50] Exodus 5:1 will take up most of the [02:53] session. [02:55] Now I I never say that but the reason [02:57] that I'm saying I'm I'm exaggerating. It [02:59] won't but it'll it it will get more than [03:02] its share at least theoretically. [03:06] Look at the sentence [03:09] and this is where study is critical and [03:13] you realize on one's own that is without [03:18] the great commentators and without [03:20] studying it's it's virtually impossible [03:23] to get the uh the real basic ideas or of [03:27] of a of many of the verses. I mean [03:29] clearly here, O Israel, the Lord our [03:31] one, the Lord is God. You can do on your [03:33] own, but you already know that Judaism [03:35] affirms monotheism and so on. But this [03:38] one, this verse would seem to anybody I [03:42] think on 50th reading as saying [03:46] basically nothing. [03:48] And it's it says a lot. Uh so let's go [03:54] to it. Afterward, Moses and Aaron went [03:57] and said to Pharaoh, "Thus says the [03:59] Lord, the God of Israel, let my people [04:01] go that they may celebrate a festival [04:03] for me in the wilderness." [04:06] Does not strike one. Correct. Allan, did [04:08] you see anything? Okay, good. Uh cuz if [04:12] he did, I would be up the creek. I But [04:14] I'm I'm glad that uh [04:18] who, Ladies and gentlemen, uh [04:22] what does it say in verse 29? right [04:25] before chapter 5. And Moses and Aaron [04:28] went and assembled all the elders of of [04:31] the Israelites, right? All the elders. [04:33] Now, you will recall please in 318. [04:38] Okay, please go to 3:18. What were the [04:42] what was the directive? You'll have to [04:44] refer a lot to 318 to understand the [04:47] complexity of 51. Okay, that's the [04:50] reason. Normally, I don't have you go [04:52] back. I'll just read it to you, but it's [04:54] worth your seeing. 3:18. [04:57] Uh, this is God telling this is when God [05:00] is at the burning bush, the the and [05:04] telling Mo Moshe Mo Moses what he has to [05:07] do when he goes to Egypt. And what will [05:10] happen? Okay, so [05:14] they will listen to you. Okay, and then [05:17] you shall go with the elders of Israel [05:19] to the king of Egypt. [05:21] So before I even go on, do you [05:24] understand problem number one in 51? [05:30] Where are the elders? [05:35] Right? And he just met with them at the [05:37] end of chapter 4. Where are the elders? [05:40] I mean, it has to be pretty direct here. [05:43] Uh there there is a real powerful hint [05:46] that it says, "And afterwards Moses and [05:48] Aaron came and said to Pharaoh, [05:52] well, according to the Midash, the the [05:55] the ancient rabbitic commentary on the [05:58] Torah, [06:00] they dropped off one by one. They were [06:04] scared to meet Pharaoh, [06:07] and Moses and Aaron ended up alone. [06:11] [clears throat] [06:11] But it's almost as if the Torah didn't [06:14] want to acknowledge. [06:16] It wanted to hint. It couldn't say and [06:20] the establishment out. It couldn't say [06:24] that. It's it's it would almost be, you [06:26] know, dishonorable. But on the other [06:28] hand, it didn't want to lie. So it the [06:31] Torah very uh indirectly but clear [06:36] Isabelle [06:37] tells you the elders were too scared to [06:40] show up as they were directed to do so. [06:43] After all that they're there two [06:44] sentences before. Let me uh read to you. [06:50] Uh well no that's that's that's exactly [06:53] I there's nothing to read to you that [06:55] that is what happened and there is um [06:58] there is there are so many parallels to [07:01] this about the establishment [07:04] or the elders being afraid [07:07] it the moment I read this commentary on [07:10] the on the Torah I thought of parallels [07:14] and I have used one frequently about how [07:18] how is it that a gener Remember the [07:20] famous generation gap of my generation, [07:23] yuppies, the 60s generation, and we said [07:27] you couldn't trust anybody over 30. I [07:29] mean, I thought that was nonsense and I [07:32] didn't buy a lot of this stuff, but I [07:33] again had very traditional values owing [07:35] to my upbringing, but my generation in [07:38] general bought into this alienation from [07:41] the elders. [07:43] And [07:44] I it is a fascinating thing, but I [07:48] wonder [07:50] do people as they get older get a little [07:53] more afraid? [07:56] And I would argue that the answer is [07:57] yes. And it is not necessarily their [08:02] fault [08:03] there. Like I'm not getting older. I'm [08:07] more afraid now of certain things. I'm [08:09] more afraid now of dying than I was at [08:11] 20. Not that I fear not that I fear [08:14] dying. [08:16] It's not that I fear the act of dying or [08:18] what happens afterwards now as opposed [08:20] to when I was 20. For one thing, I have [08:23] a family now. So, there's much more at [08:26] stake with my life than there was at 20. [08:29] Well, you know how teenagers are [08:30] cavalier about mortality? That can't [08:33] happen to me. Seat belt. Give me a [08:35] break. Right? As you get older, two [08:39] things happen. one there is more [08:41] especially at middle age more weight [08:43] upon you and I don't mean pounds alone [08:46] but uh more the the weight of [08:49] responsibility you have a family you [08:51] have friends you have a world that would [08:54] that would is depending upon you with [08:56] your work and with your family in in [08:58] particular but there is a bigger reason [09:01] too you know how precious life is as you [09:04] get older [09:06] because mortality stares you much more [09:08] in the face. And so I don't excuse the [09:12] elders of Israel and the elders of [09:15] America who caved in to my generation of [09:18] students. The the elders of universities [09:21] caved in when my generation radicals [09:25] took over offices at universities. They [09:28] did not fight them. They said, "What can [09:31] we do for you, O demonstrators?" [09:34] And it was, I think, a terrible error. [09:35] And it was it was just it's being done [09:37] to this moment. [09:39] But he that is don't never think it's [09:42] pointless to study the Torah [09:44] if you believe that the lessons of it [09:47] are not utterly universal that they do [09:50] not apply to us and our lives. The [09:54] establishment by definition is more [09:57] scared. [09:59] Whenever anything is done, somebody has [10:02] to take the initiative and generally do [10:04] it alone. [10:06] That's the way history works. Uh, [10:09] anything that is founded, uh, was was [10:11] Abraham part of the establishment? No. [10:14] Leave your father, leave that society, [10:16] leave that world, make something new. [10:19] That world won't make it. Uh, every [10:22] religion is founded by breakaway from [10:25] the establishment. [10:27] Uh, Christianity was founded breaking [10:29] away from the Jewish establishment of [10:31] its day. Islam was was created breaking [10:34] away from the Arabian establishment of [10:36] its day. Uh Muhammad Muhammad was was [10:39] kicked out of Mecca, chased out by the [10:42] authorities and then came back. People [10:45] don't change. Now, by the way, the [10:47] changes also work for the worse. [10:50] You see, but elders generally are more [10:54] conservative, wish more to conserve what [10:57] has been created, are understandably [11:00] more afraid of change. Look, we have [11:03] this is Pharaoh. I'm going to go to [11:06] Pharaoh and I am going to tell him let [11:09] let him go. And by the way, do you or do [11:12] you not think they were vindicated when [11:13] we'll see later in this chapter things [11:15] got worse for the Jews after Moses and [11:17] Aaron went? So, what do you think the [11:19] establishment felt then? Uhhuh. These [11:22] young whippers snappers, Moses and [11:24] Aaron, troublemakers. Exactly what not. [11:26] They weren't called young whippers [11:27] snappers, but they're they're called [11:29] troublemakers. And don't think elders [11:31] means, by the way, people in their 80s. [11:34] Uh it's 40 plus. [11:36] Okay. According to the Midash, we're not [11:38] talking talking about people my age. [11:41] Now, of course, Moses and Aaron are [11:42] about that age, too. I don't know the [11:43] exact age here. It would be interesting [11:45] if somebody could figure it out. And so [11:47] elders doesn't merely mean old people. [11:49] It means the authorities of the time, [11:51] but generally also older. But isn't that [11:54] interesting how if you read it, you [11:57] don't see what's missing and then you [11:58] realize what's missing is they went [12:00] alone. They weren't joined by the [12:02] elders. Now, [12:05] now let me show you what else in that [12:07] verse is very strange. [12:11] Let's go back to 3:18. God. When God [12:14] gives you a directive, let me just tell [12:16] any of you, should you meet God, I [12:19] strongly suggest that you take careful [12:21] note of what you were told to do. Okay? [12:26] In 3:18, you will you and the elders of [12:29] Israel will go to the king of Egypt and [12:32] will say to him, and notice it's say, by [12:35] the way, not direct, not order, not [12:39] demand. Say is a very sweet word. Amomar [12:42] is a is not at all aggressive [12:48] God Jehovah [12:50] where you have the Lord it means where [12:52] it says the Lord in big and little [12:55] capitals in your translations do you [12:57] most of you have the Lord [13:00] >> yes okay that means God's name Jehovah [13:03] okay it's important that you know that [13:05] because God's name is very critical to [13:07] these uh to the Torah and especially to [13:09] these uh chapters [13:11] So Jehovah, [13:14] the God of the Hebrews, [13:18] um, happened, it says here, manifested [13:23] himself to us, right? What do you have? [13:26] Anybody have a different one? [13:28] >> Happened. [13:29] >> Happened. What translation is that? [13:36] >> Yeah, I know. Who published it though? [13:38] Mitsuda. [13:40] >> Mitsuda. Yeah, that's more accurate. [13:42] Happened upon us. What do you have? [13:44] >> Met with us. [13:45] >> Hath met with us. Okay. The most literal [13:47] is happened upon us. This is very [13:50] important. I will explain later. But [13:53] please remember this is God's orders to [13:56] Moses. Tell him Jehovah the God of the [13:59] Hebrews [14:01] happened upon us. [14:03] And now please does it say Yahweh let us [14:07] go. But the word na is there which is [14:09] please. [14:10] Please. We wish to go for a period of 3 [14:15] days in the wilderness to sacrifice to [14:19] Jehovah our God. You with me? That's [14:22] what you are to ask Pharaoh. [14:25] What does Moses in fact do to Pharaoh? [14:28] Back to 51. [14:30] So far you could tell already things are [14:32] not going well because they ended up [14:34] alone without the elders. It gets worse. [14:37] Not only do the elders blow it, Moses [14:40] blows it. Okay. [14:43] So they said to Pharaoh, "Thus said [14:46] Jehovah, [14:48] the God of Israel, let my people go [14:52] so that and that so that they may [14:55] celebrate to me in the wilderness." [15:00] He blew it. I mean, it's not very close. [15:04] Let me show you how much is different [15:08] from what God told him to say. Okay. [15:12] Number one, [15:15] uh he says [15:19] God, he says to Pharaoh, they say to [15:21] Pharaoh, God Jehovah, the God of who? In [15:27] 51. [15:29] >> Israel. [15:30] What did God tell him to say? [15:32] >> Hebrews. Hebrews. Okay, he got that [15:35] wrong. It's very important the [15:38] difference between the two. And I'll [15:39] show you in a moment. Uh, next. [15:44] Uh, did he say please? [15:48] I mean, I feel like with my [15:50] three-year-old, did you say please? You [15:51] know, he didn't say please. Number [15:54] three, [15:55] did God in intimate in any way let my [15:58] people go? No. Let us please go for [16:02] three days. Not let my people go. Moses [16:06] comes in with no days. [16:09] It's let my people go forever. [16:13] Right? The whole divine tactic is blown. [16:22] God says three days in the wilderness. [16:24] He says let my people go to celebrate [16:26] me. [16:27] That's very so Hebrews please let my [16:31] people go. No three days everything is [16:35] gotten wrong as it were. You will then [16:38] understand [16:40] in part Pharaoh's reaction. Now [16:44] Pharaoh's is an obnoxious reaction. But [16:47] aside from the obnoxiousness, [16:50] God being highly intelligent foresaw [16:55] why this could be the wrong way to do [16:57] it. [16:59] Uh oh, I'm so sorry. I put it in the [17:02] wrong part of my notes. I wanted to read [17:04] to you about the the uh elders dropping [17:08] off. Remember I said I was going to read [17:10] to you and then I didn't see it. [17:13] This is from the Midrash. [17:17] Where have the elders got to? For they [17:19] are no longer listed, though the [17:21] Almighty had commanded Moses, "You must [17:24] go, you and the elders of Israel." Our [17:26] rabbis said, "The elders went along at [17:29] the beginning, but stealthily slipped [17:31] away one by one, two by two, and [17:35] disappeared. By the time they reached [17:37] Pharaoh's palace, not one of them [17:39] remained." This is witnessed by the [17:41] text. After that, Moses and Aaron [17:43] arrived. But where were the elders? They [17:45] had slipped away. Okay, I just wanted to [17:47] give you the actual source. All right. [17:52] Uh, by the way, there is an argument [17:53] that they were there, and I will explain [17:56] how that people make that argument, but [17:58] I I don't it's not generally accepted, [18:00] and I don't either. [18:02] Uh, before I go to Moses's reaction, [18:05] there is another very important element [18:08] here. [18:10] God's direction in in 3:18 [18:13] was ask Pharaoh to go three days and and [18:19] uh to make sacrifices to me, right? [18:24] Why was that God's request? Why why why [18:28] not just say as Moses did say, "Let my [18:32] people go?" [18:35] It's always bothered me. Incidentally, [18:37] you was it a was it a joke? I mean, what [18:39] if Pharaoh had said, "Three days to make [18:43] uh sacrifices to your god. Have a good [18:46] time. See you on Wednesday." [18:49] Correct. What if Pharaoh had said that? [18:51] I always wondered that as a kid. What if [18:54] Pharaoh had actually said, "That doesn't [18:57] sound so terrible. You know, take a [19:00] break. I'm a great guy." [19:03] And that and that was it troubled the [19:05] rabbis as well historically. [19:08] Incidentally, what if he had given in? [19:10] Is God would God then be a liar? And [19:12] it's it or or a deceiver at least? [19:17] Uh the um [19:21] the general response that I think is [19:23] best is that God knew that they wouldn't [19:26] get that. And what you do is you show in [19:31] negotiation you folks aren't even [19:33] willing to give what's reasonable from [19:36] your perspective. [19:38] That's how unreasonable. Lest it ever be [19:41] said, "Oh, well, of course, what ruler [19:44] is going to liberate all of his [19:45] servants, right?" But then you will [19:48] always be able to say after the [19:51] punishments that will be enacted against [19:54] Pharaoh, are you kidding? This man [19:57] wouldn't even allow a three-day vacation [19:59] after hundreds of years of slavery. [20:02] Imagine in the South in the United [20:04] States if if Lincoln or if a uh if a a [20:10] slave leader, a black leader would have [20:13] said, "We you all we're asking is for a [20:16] three-day break to worship." [20:19] And and plantation owners would have [20:21] said, "But are you kidding? Of course [20:23] not." Wouldn't it have shown them to be [20:27] worse [20:28] than if they had merely said no to let [20:31] us all be free forever? [20:34] The purpose of the request just let us [20:37] go three days journey into the [20:39] wilderness was to show the morality [20:43] actually of course the lack of it to [20:45] Pharaoh. And so that too has tremendous [20:49] power here. And that's why Moses really [20:52] did blow it in coming in and say, "Let [20:55] my people go." [20:57] He should have come in and said exactly [21:00] what God said with regard to that [21:02] request. And and now I'll show you why [21:05] he also uh did a bad job here, Moses, [21:09] with by saying some of the other things [21:11] he said. [21:14] Verse two. [21:16] Now Pharaoh's response [21:20] but Pharaoh said or and Pharaoh said who [21:23] is Jehovah that I should listen to his [21:27] voice to send Israel out. [21:31] I don't know Jehovah [21:33] and Israel uh I won't let go. [21:38] Okay. [21:41] Now, [21:42] Sarna has an poetic point here and then [21:44] I'll do the less poetic. It's very [21:47] interesting. What was Moses's response [21:50] to God when God spoke to him? He says, [21:53] "Who am I?" [21:55] When when [21:57] God's word is spoken to Pharaoh, [21:59] Pharaoh's response is, "Who is God?" He [22:02] has an interesting juiposition, right? [22:07] Moses in Hebrew says, "Meanohi, who am [22:09] I?" And Pharaoh says, "Me Adonai, who's [22:13] God?" [22:15] Right? It's just a very interesting and [22:17] poetic juosition of the of the of the [22:19] civilizations that are clashing here and [22:22] obviously the men who were clashing [22:24] here. [22:24] >> This episode of Timeless [music] Wisdom [22:26] will continue right after this. [22:31] >> When someone you love is hurting, what [22:33] do you do? We're often quick to say, "If [22:36] there's anything I can do, just let me [22:38] know." [22:38] >> [music] [22:38] >> But what if we stopped waiting to be [22:40] asked and simply showed up? On the If [22:43] There Is Anything I Can Do podcast, Pam [22:45] McConnell [music] shares real stories, [22:47] biblical wisdom, and practical ways to [22:49] walk alongside people [music] through [22:51] grief, loss, and life's hardest moments. [22:53] Learn how to show up and make a [22:55] difference. [music] Subscribe now at [22:56] kovepodcast.com, [22:58] YouTube, or wherever you [music] listen [23:00] to podcasts. [23:03] >> Now, back to more of Dennis Prager's [23:06] Timeless Wisdom. [23:09] Uh there is more however [23:12] that uh in this uh in this sentence [23:16] when he says uh who is God? [23:22] The idea [23:25] uh the idea of God is simply utterly [23:28] foreign to Moses and it wants the reader [23:31] the Torah wants us to know how foreign [23:35] the idea of God is to Moses. This by the [23:39] way is a very powerful statement. One of [23:41] the reasons I believe in the divine [23:43] origins of the Torah is that things [23:46] become more valuable. Certain verses [23:48] take on value thousands of years later. [23:51] For example, there is a uh there is a [23:55] very tiny body of thought publicized [23:58] today unfortunately by some afroentrists [24:01] that the idea of monotheism came from [24:04] the Egyptians because of their belief in [24:06] the sun god Rah. [24:09] But it's almost as if knowing that the [24:14] Torah put in 3,000 years ago Pharaoh's [24:18] response. I don't know who you're [24:19] talking about. [24:21] So that it is utterly clear to any [24:24] reader [24:25] from that date on it was clear the [24:29] Egyptians never heard of this one god of [24:31] the world. Okay. So again what might [24:36] have appeared less significant is [24:37] profoundly significant. Pharaoh [24:40] statement who is very important. He [24:44] never heard of him or at least acts [24:46] certainly acts that way. [24:48] So that is uh that is Pharaoh's [24:51] response. [24:54] Then Moses realizes he blew it. Moses [24:59] then realizes that what he was asked by [25:03] God to say has can you imagine [25:07] uh Moses's reaction to Pharaoh? [25:10] I mean my God I I came here expecting [25:13] him to say yes, [25:15] right? God appears to him. God has all [25:17] these signs and instead who's God and [25:21] Israel are not sending. Have a nice day. [25:25] So Moses is obviously disturbed here. [25:29] And then as it were he realizes, "Oh my [25:33] God, I I didn't do what I was told. Let [25:36] me try the right request now." And [25:38] changes everything. Notice what does he [25:42] say in three. [25:45] the God of the Hebrews. Notice the [25:48] switch now. Now he's talking as God told [25:52] him, not God of Israel. Pharaoh doesn't [25:56] know them as Israel. [25:59] Pharaoh knows them as the Hebrews. Okay? [26:02] He knows who Israel is, but he they're [26:04] called to them Hebrews. The God of the [26:07] Hebrews. [26:09] And now this is important again. It says [26:14] happened upon us. Though interestingly [26:17] and uh I need to do research on this. [26:21] The word in Hebrew is identical but the [26:23] spelling is different from 318 to 53. [26:27] 318. [26:39] The word is nikra. [26:42] And uh there are many uh definitions to [26:46] kah the Hebrew verb. One is uh called [26:50] out [26:52] or called and one is happened in modern [26:56] Hebrew the same thing. Makara you you'll [26:59] hear that in Israel. What happened? [27:01] So with a hey it's happened. That's what [27:05] God told [27:08] Moses to say. Moses here again gets it a [27:12] little wrong if I because it's the olive [27:16] word and it's here uh um where it's [27:20] really called called to us. But I'm [27:23] going to leave it as happened. I just [27:25] want you to know that that olive and hay [27:27] may make a difference. At any rate, Mo [27:30] Moses recasts his request. First of all, [27:35] it's no longer an order. remember, [27:38] let my people go is in order, right? [27:40] You're going to order Pharaoh, right? [27:42] The first time you meet him and and so [27:45] on. So now God, the God of the Hebrews, [27:49] okay, [27:51] happened upon us or called to us [27:56] and he now uses please. [27:59] May we please go exactly like God told [28:02] them to for 3 days into the wilderness [28:07] and uh sacrifice to Jehovah our God, [28:12] lest lest he strike us with pestilence [28:17] or by the sword, [28:20] which he adds here. And that was a smart [28:23] addition. [28:25] This was not a bad addition. And I'll [28:27] explain why it's a smart addition in a [28:28] minute. But notice now it is recasted [28:31] entirely as God had told him to. Please [28:34] let us go three days. No more let my [28:37] people go. Can we please go for three [28:39] days and then and then a sacrifice to [28:41] God. And it is the God of the Hebrews. [28:43] Now I'm let me start from the beginning [28:47] of the sentence. [28:48] He now has to talk pagan talk to uh to [28:53] Pharaoh. [28:56] Pharaoh is not an ethical monotheist. [28:59] Pharaoh is a pagan. Pharaoh is a [29:02] polytheist. [29:03] So, first of all, he has to make clear [29:06] who is this god you you ask me about. [29:09] He's the god of the Hebrews. That makes [29:11] total sense to a pagan. Everybody, every [29:14] group has a god. So, in the ancient [29:17] world, THAT PERFECTLY MAKES SENSE. OH, [29:19] that's who you're talking about, a god. [29:22] Now, but how do you get gods in the [29:24] ancient world? How does it happen to be [29:27] that this is the god of this group or [29:29] this is the god of this group? The [29:31] answer is pointless. It's pointless. [29:34] It's by Caprice. [29:36] Are you with me? The idea that there is [29:39] purpose, [29:41] divine purpose to the world is Jewish, [29:44] is biblical. [29:47] It's it it ends all paganism. that idea. [29:51] The previous idea was there are gods [29:53] like for example when I taught Noah I [29:55] taught about how it is that Utna Pishtim [29:58] instead in in the Mesopotamian parable [30:01] of the flood is picked by his god and [30:04] that is because he's handsome. [30:07] Okay, it's Caprice. Ah, he's a [30:10] good-looking guy. I'll save him. Noah is [30:13] saved because he's decent and righteous. [30:16] It's the dull difference in the world. [30:18] So now we have here again talk pagan and [30:23] that is what God told him to say. Talk [30:26] pagan to Pharaoh he won't understand [30:28] you. Say the God of the Hebrews happened [30:33] upon us. [30:35] Not there is divine revelation to [30:37] humanity and he is using us as a vehicle [30:40] and messenger to humanity. [30:42] Get it? That will not do well. [30:46] this God, the God of the Hebrews who [30:48] happened upon us. Let me read to you [30:51] Nama Liuich [30:53] uh the great she is one of the great [30:55] scholars of our time [30:59] and uh [31:03] let's see if I got it. Let's see what [31:04] page what page what said 96. One second. [31:10] Yeah. [31:11] Happened upon us. [31:14] The nikrain who happened upon us [31:16] predicated of God has in Hersh's view [31:19] following ancient rabbitic exugesus [31:21] unmistakable idolatrous associations. It [31:25] reflects a world view that attributes [31:28] everything to blind chance [31:32] even the encounter with God. [31:36] compare Bam Balam the the the pagan [31:40] priest later in numbers his words [31:43] perhaps the Lord will chance to meet me [31:47] that's how he speaks later in numbers a [31:51] pagan priest get it will per chance [31:54] happenare [31:56] all right to me in other words the god [32:00] of whom we have had no experience over [32:03] the last 300 years and more advanced or [32:07] happened [32:09] and called on us to offer him sacrifice. [32:12] That's what he is saying. These are [32:15] words Pharaoh can understand. [32:18] Okay. And by the way, this interesting [32:20] addition, after all, Pharaoh could say, [32:23] "That's quite a God you have allowing [32:25] you allowing you to suffer for 300 [32:28] years. You might want to consider our [32:30] God. We do a lot better with him." So [32:33] that too would make sense to Pharaoh. Ah [32:36] he finally by chance happened to call [32:39] upon us. You get it? This will make [32:42] sense to Pharaoh. Now why does he add [32:45] Moses lest he strike us with pestilence [32:49] or sword? [32:52] If we don't do this, we believe our God [32:55] will kill us. You want to lose your [32:58] slaves? [33:01] The US, by the way, can hint depending [33:04] on how Moses's uh body language was at [33:08] the moment. Could have hinted at all of [33:11] us are going to get killed if you don't [33:13] let us out. Get it? Even Egyptians. But [33:18] so the us is is somewhat ambiguous. [33:26] Okay. So now they finally did it. Moses [33:29] and Aaron finally did it right. They add [33:31] please. They do the three days. They say [33:33] God of Hebrews. Okay. [33:36] Now, at least they're going to get an [33:38] answer. It's a miserable answer, but at [33:41] least Pharaoh understands. He doesn't go [33:43] what? He gives them an answer. Verse [33:47] four. [33:49] And he said to them, the king of Egypt [33:52] said to them, Moses and Aaron, why are [33:56] you bothering this nation from its Why [34:01] are you disturbing it from its works? Go [34:05] back to your labors. [34:07] This, by the way, go back to your [34:09] labors. [34:13] um [34:14] is the one there is a tiny group of [34:18] medieval rabbis who wanted to believe [34:21] the elders really did show up and said [34:24] this can't possibly refer to Moses and [34:26] Aaron who weren't working. [34:29] Okay, so that maybe he was referring to [34:32] them. I just want you to know that there [34:33] is that body of thought that wants to [34:35] get the elders off the hook, but uh I [34:38] don't buy it. [34:40] So go back to your go back to your [34:42] labors. Why are you bothering this [34:44] people? Why are you disturbing uh their [34:47] uh their fine? You're stirring them up. [34:51] And of course, [34:54] this immediately places the blame for [34:57] what is going to happen on Moses and [34:59] Aaron. Okay. [35:02] Verse five. [35:04] And Pharaoh said, "You know, they're [35:07] very uh there are a lot of them uh in [35:09] the land today, and you are uh you would [35:13] have them stop working." In other words, [35:16] are you joking? I'm going to let this [35:19] massive army of workers leave, take off, [35:22] go on strike. The Hebrew here form [35:26] is to this day in Hebrew, a shita is a [35:29] strike. So, it could actually be you're [35:33] gonna let them I'm going to have them go [35:34] on strike. You must be joking. [35:38] So, then six Pharaoh [35:42] uh Pharaoh uh orders [35:45] uh that day. Very important that it says [35:49] that day because Pharaoh wanted it clear [35:53] to the Hebrews that it was because of [35:56] Moses and Aaron coming to him that the [35:59] following was going to happen. You with [36:01] me? [36:02] That day, Pharaoh commands [36:08] uh the um the task masters and the [36:12] foremen of the uh the foremen uh saying, [36:21] "You will no longer provide the people [36:23] with straw for making bricks as hereto [36:26] for. let them go and gather straw for [36:31] themselves, [36:33] which is horrible. I mean, when you [36:35] think about it, they have to make it [36:37] themselves. Not only build themselves, [36:40] they have to make the bricks with the [36:42] straw. They have to go and collect it [36:45] and [36:47] uh impose upon them the exact same [36:50] quotota as they had been before. do not [36:54] reduce it because they sherk their [36:57] sherkers [37:00] and [37:01] by by yelling going out and yelling, [37:03] "Hey, let's go and sacrifice to our [37:06] God." Of course, he uses the universal [37:09] term for God, not Jehovah. [37:13] Uh, make the work heavier. And by the [37:17] way, it is the same word as God making [37:20] uh Pharaoh's heart hard. The same work [37:25] and I'm sure that there is again [37:29] the Torah is if there's any one word [37:32] that would animate its passion, its [37:34] justice. Very deep believer. If you did [37:38] X, you deserve anti-X. [37:41] If you made their work cave, I'm going [37:43] to make your heart cave. which I talked [37:46] about last week about the issue of free [37:48] will and I hope you remember it or or [37:50] get the tape or both. [37:54] Make the work heavier uh on the uh on [37:58] these uh on the people on the men and [38:01] let them do it and don't let them pay [38:03] attention to uh lying words. [38:09] So Pharaoh's response to Moses and Aaron [38:12] is immediate and awesome. [38:15] make it much harder and make it clear [38:18] that it's because they're sherkers. Now, [38:20] of course, the interesting thing is the [38:23] people are going to say, "What do you [38:24] mean sherkers?" And then the word's [38:26] going to get around. Yeah. Well, Moses [38:28] and Aaron went and said, "We should take [38:29] a three-day holiday." [38:31] >> You with me? That's how he does it. Cuz [38:34] otherwise, they wouldn't understand. Why [38:35] is Pharaoh doing this? So, he says, "Cuz [38:36] you're sherkers. You want to go out and [38:38] and uh and do these things." To which he [38:41] is wanting obviously the Jews to say, [38:43] "Get out of here, Moses." and Aaron, [38:45] things were bad before you came. They're [38:48] hell now. [38:50] We never asked to have this three-day uh [38:52] feast to God. What are you doing to us? [38:55] That is the whole purpose of what [38:57] Pharaoh was doing here. [39:01] Uh [39:03] and so the task masters and the foremen [39:07] uh went out and said to the people, [39:09] "Thus said Pharaoh using the same words [39:13] kamar as as Moses said, thus said God. [39:18] Pharaoh is God." In other words, which [39:21] kamar do you want to listen to? which [39:24] thus said Jews, thus said your your God [39:28] or thus said Pharaoh. We're going to [39:31] show you that the thus said that really [39:32] matters is the thus said of Pharaoh. Not [39:35] Komar Adonai, but Kamar Pharaoh. [39:40] I And so thus said Pharaoh, I am not [39:44] giving you straw. [39:47] You must go and get the straw yourselves [39:50] wherever you'll find it. But there is no [39:54] reduction uh from uh not the slightest [39:59] not an iota of of reduction of your [40:02] work. [40:03] And the people scattered throughout uh [40:06] throughout Egypt in order uh to find [40:11] um stubble for straw. [40:17] And the task masters pressed them. [40:23] This is 13 saying, "You must complete [40:27] the same work assignment each day as [40:30] when you had straw." [40:34] So there are two there are two levels of [40:36] of overseers to the Hebrews. Taskmasters [40:41] and foremen. You with me? Four men are [40:47] Israelites, task masters are Egyptians. [40:52] It is eerie beyond words the I how [40:55] similar it is to what the Nazis did with [40:58] Uden Rat uh with Jewish councils in [41:02] gathering the Jews and with the um [41:07] uh what are the what was the [41:09] >> huh? Capos, right? with the capos in the [41:13] death camps and concentration camps to [41:16] the extent possible it was Jews over [41:20] Jews [41:22] so that it's even more demoralizing and [41:25] the dirty work is done by them and and [41:29] again it's profoundly demoralizing [41:31] that's the worst part of it just exactly [41:35] as the Nazis did he Pharaoh did and the [41:38] foreman of the Israelites [41:42] uh whom Pharaoh's task masters had set [41:45] over them. You see, it goes out of its [41:48] way to say they didn't take this role as [41:51] foremen over their fellow Jews. They [41:54] were made into foremen over their fellow [41:57] slaves, their fellow Hebrews by Pharaoh. [42:00] Okay? [42:02] They were beaten. [42:05] Why they were asked they why were they [42:07] beaten? because they were asked why did [42:10] you not complete the prescribed amount [42:12] of bricks either yesterday or today as [42:15] you did before. [42:17] Now it's very interesting that they were [42:19] they were beaten and the um uh according [42:23] to Liowitz at least the Israel Israelite [42:26] foremen were beaten because obviously [42:29] they didn't meet the Israelites didn't [42:32] fulfill their work quota. It's Rashi, [42:34] excuse me. Rashi says, "The four men [42:37] couldn't mistreat their Jews enough to [42:39] make them meet the quota." Liberowitz's [42:42] words, "Rather than beat their brothers, [42:44] they suffered a beating." [42:47] And I think that that's right. A lot of [42:49] times Rashi just wants to show the Jews [42:51] in a good light. But I think in this [42:53] case it is a fair one that the four men [42:56] just didn't have it in them to beat [42:58] their fellow Hebrews to get the results [43:01] that they wanted that the Egyptians [43:03] wanted and so took the beating [43:05] themselves from the task masters who [43:08] were the Egyptians. [43:12] Then the four men of the Israelites came [43:15] to Pharaoh [43:17] and uh and cried. It's it's actually in [43:21] Hebrew it's more than cried. Sak is [43:25] screamed. It's screaming crying. It's [43:28] crying from pain. It's not vaive coup [43:31] you know sobbing or weeping. This was [43:34] this was painful [43:37] crying out. [43:40] Why are you dealing thus with your [43:43] servants? [43:45] In these two sentences, your servants, [43:49] which of course in Hebrew is is [43:51] difficult. The word for servant and the [43:54] word for slave is the same, [43:57] which is probably why to this day Jews [43:59] don't like to be servants. [44:01] Because they think it's slavery. Did you [44:03] ever meet a Jewish waiter? [44:06] I guess you didn't. Otherwise, you would [44:07] have laughed. That's part of the reason [44:09] you never met a Jewish waiter is because [44:11] Jews don't wait. Uh I I am not kidding. [44:15] I am convinced that the the fact that [44:18] servant enslaved is the same word in [44:20] Hebrew [44:22] uh has helped develop that and many [44:25] other things like the chosen people [44:26] notion that Jews don't want to serve [44:29] anybody. Uh and and it has historically [44:32] been that way. Uh it's a fascinating [44:34] sociological [44:36] and psychological phenomenon. It may it [44:38] may be all off base, but I don't think [44:40] so. That's why I'm I'm I'm offering it [44:43] not as an a way out thought. At any [44:46] rate, why are you doing this? Why are [44:48] you acting this way to your servants? [44:52] Again, three times in two verses, your [44:55] servants. No straw is issued to your [44:58] servants. [45:00] Yet they demand of us. Notice [45:04] it doesn't say you demand of us. [45:07] You You don't know. It's almost [45:10] impossible to appreciate the insight of [45:12] this text, the insight into [45:14] totalitarianism [45:15] and enslavers. [45:17] >> This episode of Timeless [music] Wisdom [45:19] will continue right after this. [45:23] >> When someone you love is hurting, what [45:25] do you do? We're often quick to say, "If [45:28] there's anything I can do, just let me [45:30] know." [music] But what if we stopped [45:32] waiting to be asked and simply showed [45:34] up? On the If There is Anything I Can Do [45:36] podcast, Pam McConnell shares real [45:39] stories, [music] biblical wisdom, and [45:41] practical ways to walk alongside people [45:43] through grief, loss, and life's hardest [45:45] moments. Learn how to show up and make a [45:47] difference. Subscribe [music] now at [45:49] klopppodcast.com, [45:51] YouTube, or wherever you listen to [45:52] podcasts. [45:56] Now, back to more of Dennis Prager's [45:58] timeless wisdom. [46:00] >> You [music] did you ever wonder my field [46:02] of study, which if you didn't know, you [46:04] wouldn't guess if people gave you 8,000 [46:06] guesses, was communist affairs? I mean, [46:09] just how many people study that and at [46:11] least then end up teaching Torah? [46:16] Actually, I'd be unemployed today if I [46:17] went into it as a field. I'm glad I [46:19] didn't. And I'm glad I would be [46:21] unemployed. At any rate, but that was my [46:24] field and I spent a lot of time studying [46:26] obviously communist countries and I [46:29] remember when I was studying Stalin and [46:32] his death March 5th, 1953 [46:35] afterwards [46:37] the there were massive massive [46:40] displays of weeping and wailing in [46:43] Russia. [46:45] Now, how do you do that? How do you weep [46:47] and whail for the greatest tyrant in [46:51] history with the exception of Hitler? [46:54] And arguably with regard to his own [46:56] people, worse. Not arguably, he was. [47:00] Hitler didn't kill one quintilion the [47:03] number of Germans that Stalin did of [47:05] Russians and other Soviet citizens. [47:08] And yet there was all that weeping. when [47:11] I read texts about uh for example, oh [47:15] this is even more powerful example. [47:18] Do you do any of you know that in the [47:20] 1930s there were enormous show trials in [47:23] the Soviet Union in Moscow where Stalin [47:26] had uh major communist figures called [47:31] purged. The word is purged meaning [47:33] constantly removing any possible threat [47:36] to his leadership. So he would take the [47:38] communist leadership and then put them [47:40] in trials and torture them or threaten [47:43] the death of their families if they [47:46] didn't go on the trial and say they were [47:47] spies for America or or were there to [47:52] sabotage all the electricity of Russia. [47:55] Are you with me? [47:57] Do you know what these prisoners would [48:00] say in prison to the to their torturers [48:04] and interrogators? [48:06] Let me just speak to Stalin. [48:10] He would understand what a terrible [48:12] mistake my being arrested was. [48:17] They couldn't believe that Stalin gave [48:19] the orders for their own death. [48:24] What are they saying to Pharaoh here? [48:27] They're not saying, [48:29] "Look, [48:31] no straw is issued to your servants. Yet [48:34] you demand. They're saying you as your [48:37] servants. They could continue the [48:39] sentence. Yet you demand make bricks. [48:44] No, they're demanding [48:47] in a an in an a slave mentality [48:51] is precisely the mentality of my owner [48:56] can do no wrong. [48:58] Do you you you with me? There must be [49:01] some mistake here. Pharaoh, [49:04] it's your it's your you don't realize [49:06] what was what was ordered of us. You get [49:10] it now? How it's interesting how they [49:12] switched it from your servants not you [49:16] ordered they ordered. [49:21] Why do they say three times in one [49:24] sentence, two verses, your servants [49:29] to repeatedly [49:31] assert uh to uh to Pharaoh, our fidelity [49:36] to you is second to none. Please know we [49:40] are faithful. We're your servants. Your [49:42] servants. It's the graveling technique [49:44] that is that is used here. [49:48] 17. He replied, [49:52] "You're sherkers. You're sherkers." [49:58] And therefore, [50:00] because you're sherkers, you say, "Let's [50:04] go and make sacrifices [50:08] to uh our uh to to Jehovah." He uses uh [50:13] Jehovah there. And now be off to your [50:17] work. [50:19] No straw shall be issued to you, [50:24] but you must produce your quota of [50:26] bricks. [50:29] Not a successful meeting. [50:33] Now the foreman of the Israelites, 19, [50:36] found themselves in trouble because of [50:39] the order. [50:41] you because of the order, you must not [50:43] reduce your daily quantity of bricks. [50:47] Why did they find themselves in trouble? [50:51] It's obvious. This is what they have to [50:52] pass on. They're the o they're the ones [50:55] who have to give these orders to the to [50:57] the Israelites. [50:59] As they left Pharaoh's presence, [51:02] [clears throat] [51:07] they bumped in or they they met [51:12] Moses and Aaron standing in their path. [51:15] It's very touching. It's as if Moses and [51:18] Aaron had some guilt. and they did [51:22] feeling terrible that this had happened [51:25] and were like standing there almost [51:27] sheepishly waiting for these men to meet [51:30] with them. In other words, the the [51:32] foremen did not have to call Moses and [51:34] Aaron. You get it? That's very [51:36] important. [51:38] They they were like they were waiting [51:40] outside the palace as it were to speak [51:43] with them. And they said to them that as [51:46] the foreman said to Moses and Aaron, [51:49] "May May God look upon you and punish [51:52] you [51:54] for making us loathome to Pharaoh and [51:57] his courters, [51:59] putting a sword in their hand to slay [52:02] us." [52:03] Can you imagine [52:06] how Moses and Aaron must have felt? [52:09] Especially Moses, he never wanted the [52:12] job. [52:14] I am certain as I stand before you that [52:18] Moses at this point is saying, "I didn't [52:20] want this. I didn't need this. I was [52:24] happy in Midyan. I am ticked off at [52:28] God." There is no doubt. And you'll see [52:31] he is ticked off at God. He yells at [52:33] him, but he's ticked off not only [52:36] because things got worse. He didn't want [52:38] it. [52:40] I needed THIS TROUBLE. LIFE WAS [52:42] WONDERFUL. Wife and kids, a [52:44] father-in-law who liked me, [52:48] right? [52:50] I begged not to have this. I knew it was [52:52] a problem. So, he and he, how does he [52:55] feel? He probably wants to say this to [52:58] the foreman. What do you want me to do? [53:00] But he can't say that. You know what's [53:02] what do you want me to do? What we want [53:04] you to do? Not go to Pharaoh. That's [53:05] what did we ask you to go to Pharaoh? [53:11] lady, we didn't ask you. So the foremen [53:14] had absolute it's totally understandable [53:17] why they're so angry. You should you [53:20] should be punished. You you made a [53:21] lathome. God should punish you. But of [53:25] course, that's the irony. God stuck me [53:27] here. You know, punish me. You know [53:29] what? You know, he So anyway, then Moses [53:33] returned to God right after that. [53:36] And this, my friends, is a very very [53:40] powerful [53:42] uh uh two verses. This is not unique, [53:46] but almost unique in the Torah. There [53:49] are arguments with God, but there I [53:52] don't know of any accusations against [53:55] God. [53:58] Okay. Abraham argues, "Are you going to [54:01] kill everybody? You know what? There [54:03] were 50 righteous. That's a that's an [54:05] argument. This is an attack. [54:09] You did bad. [54:13] That in that regard, it is unique. [54:18] And it is why I whenever these things [54:21] occur in the Torah, I always reemphasize [54:24] this is what makes me in part a [54:28] believer, a believing Jew because I have [54:32] fights with God and my religion not only [54:36] allows it, it cultivates it. The [54:39] greatest Jew who ever lived attacked [54:41] God. By the way, the whole idea of this [54:44] and then I'll talk to we'll obviously [54:46] read the attack is fascinating. Don't [54:50] you think if God met you that that would [54:52] answer all your questions? [54:57] I think that after all, you know, you [55:01] know, I think it was Woody Allen in one [55:03] of his either movie or one of his funny [55:06] little essays said, you know, I don't I [55:08] don't answers. I just don't have them. [55:12] And yet all these people meet God and [55:16] still have questions. [55:18] So certitude of God's existence [55:21] apparently doesn't answer all our [55:23] questions. [55:25] That's what has always boggled me about [55:28] these arguments with God. I mean, if God [55:31] is really God, who am I to argue? And [55:34] yet, for some reason that I cannot [55:36] understand because I never met God like [55:38] this. It doesn't answer that they're [55:42] certain of God. I mean, to Moses, the [55:44] idea of atheism would be ludicrous. He [55:46] that he would be denying his own [55:48] experience, right? So, it's not a [55:50] question that there's atheism is [55:52] possible. [55:54] But there are questions. All right. [55:56] You're God. [55:58] What is your nature? See, that's why, [56:00] ladies and gentlemen, we ask wrong [56:03] questions a lot of times. And that's why [56:06] a lot of people are theologically [56:07] confused. People say, for example, I [56:10] can't believe in God after the [56:12] Holocaust. That to me doesn't make [56:14] sense. What makes sense is to say, I [56:17] don't understand God or I don't love [56:20] God. [56:22] That makes sense to me. [56:25] The issue with God is really I we don't [56:28] understand how a good God has a world of [56:32] such horror. [56:34] That's what the confusion is. But deep [56:37] down, do you really think everything is [56:39] total accident? There's nothing out [56:42] there. Most people don't think that. [56:45] Most people in their gut think there's [56:47] something just some even a deist. [56:50] There's somebody, [56:52] some intelligence is behind all this. [56:55] That's why these questions are sharp. [56:58] They're not, "Oh, Moses could have gone, [57:01] ah, there's no God." Because that's so [57:03] silly. He knows there's a God. He's [57:06] ticked off at God. [57:08] And you're allowed to be in Judaism. [57:11] Does God punish Moses for being angry at [57:14] him? You will see in no way. Unlike, by [57:18] the way, when God got finally annoyed [57:21] with him trying to get out of the [57:22] mission right at the burning bush here. [57:25] There is complete acceptance of Moses's [57:28] attacks. [57:30] Total acceptance. [57:32] because to do otherwise God would have [57:35] been unfair. [57:38] I send you to do a task, you do the task [57:40] and you get clobbered for it. I [57:42] understand you're you're annoyed. But of [57:44] course, that's not why Moses is annoyed. [57:46] And that's Moses's greatness. Now, now [57:48] what is his attack? Moses returned to [57:51] God [58:01] and said, "God, why did you bring harm?" [58:05] In Hebrew, it's much more powerful. Lama [58:08] harot from the word ra. Why did you do [58:12] evil? That's the Hebrew. I can't stand [58:15] when they when they, you know, give you [58:18] rosecoled interpretations. [58:20] Why did you do evil? I I mean, folks, do [58:23] you understand that? A man talking to [58:27] God and saying, why did you do evil? Not [58:31] let it happen. You did it. He's saying [58:36] we asked with Ashvitz, why did you let [58:38] it happen? He said, why did you do it? [58:44] That's the most direct. You can't get [58:46] worse than that attack. Just tell God to [58:48] his face you did evil. [58:52] And then so he asks two things. The he [58:55] asked two great questions. Why did you [58:58] do evil? And why did you send me [59:01] right? [59:03] It's not working [59:06] and I'm not happy with this job. Could [59:09] you What do What do companies do when [59:11] they send you to another city? What's [59:12] the word? [59:14] >> Relocate. [59:15] >> Relocate. Yes. Would you relocate me, [59:17] please? I hear that there are problems [59:20] in Babylon. Perhaps I could handle some [59:23] of those. [59:25] [clears throat] [59:27] Uh, [59:31] since I came to Pharaoh to speak in your [59:34] name, that's the beauty of it. to speak [59:37] in your name. [59:40] He has done evil. Same word. Ha. [59:44] Same word. That's really digging in to [59:47] God. You and Pharaoh did the same thing. [59:52] Wow. You realize I there's nothing like [59:55] this in biblical literature of the Bible [59:59] of any religion I am aware of. its [60:02] leading prophet accusing God of evil. [60:07] That's staggering stuff. And nobody [60:09] points this out. I don't see this as [60:11] isolated. Everybody knows Job, but Job [60:14] just questioned. I don't understand. How [60:17] come? I was a good guy. That's it. [60:21] This is by the prophet of God, the most [60:24] direct communicator to God in Jewish [60:28] history, yelling at God for being evil. [60:31] comparing God to Pharaoh. He did evil. [60:35] You did evil. Same word. In your name, I [60:39] came to Pharaoh. And since then, he has [60:42] done e. See what? Look at he's dealt [60:45] worse. He did evil to this this nation, [60:48] this people. [60:50] And you have certainly not saved your [60:55] people. [60:56] >> This is accusation. [60:58] >> It's a It's a big accusation. Exactly. [61:02] Now, [61:05] the truth is [61:08] God does have an answer. He doesn't use [61:11] it, though. That's why I have to hand it [61:14] to God. [61:16] I do. I really do because God has a very [61:20] You You know what? God has a very [61:23] rational response. [61:27] Can anybody guess what God's Absolutely. [61:29] Do you think you know what? [61:31] >> Absolute response of Moses. I told you [61:34] what to say. [61:35] >> He's right. [61:37] >> No. Oh. Oh, I'm sorry. You're almost [61:40] right. I thought you had it on the nose. [61:42] Better than that. He said, "Moses, I [61:44] told you what to say. You flubbed the [61:46] mission." But he didn't really flub the [61:48] mission cuz he he he did it the second [61:50] time. He did ask it right the second [61:52] time. That would be fair. But God would [61:55] look terribly petty then cuz everybody [61:57] reading going, "This is what God comes [61:59] up with. Blames it on Moses. Give me a [62:01] break." No, God had a God does have a [62:04] legit answer. The legit answer is this [62:08] is exactly what I told you would happen. [62:14] That's the legit answer. Please look [62:17] at 3:19. [62:21] And that's why when God doesn't make [62:23] this answer, I am very impressed with [62:25] God, which I know does not move God, but [62:29] you might be moved by it cuz uh God [62:33] really has [62:35] a legit answer in this case. [62:40] Uh 19. I know that the king of Egypt, [62:44] Excuse me, one second. [62:49] Yeah. [62:50] uh will not [62:53] will not let you go. I don't know why [62:55] they have this is such strange uh [62:57] translation here. It says here we'll let [62:59] you go only because of greater mind. In [63:01] Hebrew it is [63:03] you will ask God these things. Remember [63:05] we did 3:18 and then God says in 3:19 [63:08] and I know [63:10] that he won't let you go [63:13] only with very after I show great powers [63:18] and might and signs and hit them right [63:22] which he hasn't done. So he could say, [63:25] "Wait a minute. I told you he's not [63:28] going to let you go." [63:31] God doesn't say that. Moses is [63:34] impatient, [63:36] plus terribly personally annoyed. And [63:38] that's why he said, "Why did you send [63:40] me?" He's not only annoyed that it's [63:42] worse for the Jews. And to his credit, [63:44] that's his first complaint that it's [63:46] been made worse for the Hebrews, right? [63:50] But he's personally annoyed. You sent me [63:53] and you made me you made me look you [63:56] made me hated, [63:58] right, for a mission that I didn't ask [63:59] for. [64:01] So God could have said to him, "I told [64:05] you this would happen." Because he did [64:07] tell him this would happen. [64:10] Now that's an interesting question. Then [64:12] if he did tell him it would happen, why [64:15] is he so angry? [64:20] And that raises not an issue about Moses [64:22] cuz Moses is human. That's why the [64:24] answer is Moses is human. That's why [64:26] he's angry. Okay, let's be honest. [64:30] Uh, and there's another whole dimension [64:32] about this issue that I want to raise, [64:34] but what does faith mean? [64:38] I mean, it I'm not sure I have an [64:40] answer. Everybody thinks they know. Oh, [64:42] I have faith in God. What does that [64:43] mean? Well, the two most obvious answers [64:46] are I believe that there is a God. [64:48] That's faith in God, right? The other is [64:51] I have faith, meaning I have trust. I [64:54] trust that in God meaning that things [64:56] will be for the good. Okay, is that [64:59] correct? [65:05] It also seems that faith necessitates [65:09] what the the theologians call a leap of [65:13] faith. That the human being has to jump [65:15] over reason. In other words, on reason [65:17] alone, you don't know there's a God. [65:19] Right? Reason can argue for a god, but [65:21] you still need faith. [65:25] But what? But here is a man who knew [65:28] there is a God. How could he then lack [65:31] faith? [65:34] That proves to me that there really are [65:36] two types of faith. Faith that there is [65:39] a God, which Moses obviously doesn't [65:42] have a problem with, and faith that God [65:46] will deliver. [65:51] You see, those are utterly distinct. [65:57] That's the problematic faith. And [66:00] apparently, even if God meets you, [66:04] you still don't know for certain without [66:09] faith. You need faith in God. Not that [66:13] he exists, but [snorts] that he's [66:15] trustworthy. [66:17] For which reason, God's answer coming up [66:22] is entirely about being trustworthy. [66:26] Because that's the faith problem of [66:29] Moses. [66:32] I I don't I obviously don't trust you. [66:37] That's what he's saying. I don't trust [66:39] you. [66:41] And so [66:43] God by not getting angry or dismissing [66:47] Moses but utterly answering directly [66:51] shows you know what [66:55] my trustworthiness has not been [66:57] exhibited at all. [67:00] You are right to have no faith in me. [67:05] That's I get the chills as I tell it to [67:07] you because that's the that is the [67:10] connection between his questions and [67:14] God's answer in chapter 6 that's coming [67:16] up. There's another incredibly important [67:20] point in Moses's [67:23] uh attack slashquest to God. [67:32] I have long believed and I and I owe uh [67:36] my dear friend Joseph Tlushkin credit [67:39] for [67:41] uh really helping me crystallize my [67:43] thoughts on this many we did many 20 [67:48] years ago probably when we wrote our [67:50] book um Judaism together [67:54] and we we realized a very interesting [67:57] difficulty. [67:59] It is probably [68:04] difficult [68:05] if not impossible [68:07] to love God and love humanity, humans at [68:13] the same time. [68:19] You would think, what what's the big [68:22] problem? [68:24] I mean after all love God and love man [68:26] is uh is just the basis of of of every [68:30] decent faith. [68:32] It is the basis of every decent faith. [68:36] And it's a very difficult basis. And [68:38] I'll tell you why. [68:40] If you really love people [68:44] then you so cry for their pain that it's [68:49] difficult to love God. [68:54] And if you are really intoxicated with [68:57] love of God, [69:00] it can come at the price of really [69:04] feeling the pain of human beings. [69:08] Because if you really feel their pain, [69:11] it's going to have to raise questions [69:13] about God. [69:18] That's why it's that is the basis of [69:22] great religiosity [69:24] and it's a very difficult one to meet. [69:27] That is why I have no doubt that there [69:30] have been people who loved God [69:33] [clears throat] and uh who believed [69:34] deeply in God who could torture people [69:41] because they were able to utterly [69:44] separate the two. It's when you really [69:48] feel for people that the questions about [69:51] God arise. If you don't really feel for [69:54] people, [69:56] then those questions don't particularly [69:58] arise. [70:02] And that's why I love Moses [70:04] [clears throat] [70:05] and that's why Moses is the [70:06] quintessential Jew because for Jews [70:10] there has always been that difficulty. [70:15] And that is why Jews in the 19th and [70:17] 20th century went off the deep end for a [70:21] love of humanity and became atheists. [70:24] The Jews who embraced all the radical [70:26] ideologies like Marxism and socialism [70:29] were intoxicated with love of humanity [70:33] and and just inexurably [70:37] believed it must come with atheism. [70:40] I can't. If I love the world, I I reject [70:44] and even perhaps hate the notion of God. [70:49] And by the way, they had some reason [70:53] because as a a lot of people who seem to [70:57] be intoxicated with God didn't give a [70:59] damn about people. [71:03] They would whether for example they [71:06] would see Christians oh let's say who [71:08] would be very deeply uh involved in [71:10] monasteries [71:12] but around them was was mass torture and [71:16] and and starvation [71:19] and and you know children dying on mass [71:22] and being beaten. Now I certainly don't [71:25] characterize all of Christianity that [71:26] way. Every one of you knows that. I'm [71:28] just saying though they had reason to [71:32] see that there were God intoxicated [71:34] people who didn't care about people. [71:37] They loved God, prayed all day [71:41] and and couldn't care less if people [71:43] died of children died of starvation. [71:49] And that's why you had atheist, [71:52] socialist, radical, humanityoriented [71:55] movements. The irony though is and that [71:58] is why loving God and loving man is so [72:00] critical that when you end up without [72:03] God you also ended up with human [72:06] destructive ideas. So the ideas founded [72:10] by people loving atheists namely Marxism [72:14] ended up destroying more people than any [72:17] religion ever did. [72:21] We are stuck [72:23] with God. God is stuck with us and we [72:26] are stuck with God. [72:28] That really is is the only way to [72:32] resolve this problem. [72:35] You have to love both. [72:38] If you only love man, you will end up [72:41] with moral chaos because where will good [72:44] and evil come from if there is no God? [72:47] If you only love God, you will end up [72:50] with moral chaos because you will not [72:52] care about the suffering of humanity. [72:58] Both must be loved. At this point, [73:02] Moses, the good man, [73:05] is angry at God and is not in love with [73:08] God. He is in love with these Hebrew [73:12] slaves who are being tortured. [73:16] That's the power of these two verses. [73:20] All of these all of these ideas, the [73:22] nature of faith and that there is there [73:26] does seem to be a virtual exclusivity, [73:30] mutually exclusive love of man, love of [73:32] God. [73:34] Given the serious nature of these [73:36] points, are there any questions now? [73:39] because we're at the end of chapter 5 [73:41] and I'm debating whether to start with [73:43] God's answer cuz I don't mind, you know, [73:46] ending in the middle of a par of a of a [73:49] chapter. [73:49] >> This episode of Timeless Wisdom [music] [73:51] will continue right after this. [73:56] >> When someone you love is hurting, what [73:58] do you do? We're often quick to say, "If [74:00] there's anything I can do, just let me [74:02] [music] know." But what if we stopped [74:04] waiting to be asked and simply showed [74:06] up? On the If There Is Anything I Can Do [74:09] podcast, Pam McConnell shares real [74:11] stories, [music] biblical wisdom, and [74:13] practical ways to walk alongside people [74:15] through grief, loss, [music] and life's [74:17] hardest moments. Learn how to show up [74:19] and make a difference. Subscribe now at [74:21] kovepodcast.com, [music] [74:23] YouTube, or wherever you listen to [74:25] podcasts. [74:28] >> Now, back to more [music] of Dennis [74:30] Prager's timeless wisdom. But I do want [74:33] to take going to the nature of what I [74:35] just spoke. Any comments or questions if [74:37] you have them now? Yes. [74:40] >> The uh the people that I know who are [74:42] seem to be in possibility of God. [74:46] I think that they might say that they [74:50] would not feel at all that they do not [74:52] love mankind. It would be that they [74:55] believe that God loves us all and that [74:58] there are reasons for the terrible [75:00] things that happen and that it is more [75:03] reason to find ways to serve God than [75:06] you have things terrible things happen [75:08] to you. [75:10] >> Okay. You're saying that the people you [75:12] know who are in love with God would [75:14] argue that they are in love with God and [75:16] they know that God loves everybody [75:18] >> and that they do care about humanity [75:21] >> and that these people care about [75:22] humanity. Oh, I don't I know that there [75:24] are such people. I also know that there [75:26] are others who believe that serving God [75:30] is dis is distinctive from serving [75:33] humanity. Well, I'll give you a very [75:35] simple question and this is a tough one. [75:37] I asked this to an Orthodox Jewish [75:39] friend of mine. It's a very tough [75:42] question to answer. [75:44] If you spend, let's say you spend 8 [75:47] hours a day studying Torah in the [75:49] broadest sense as the Orthodox would use [75:51] it for Talmud and all holy works. [75:56] Those are hours that theoretically you [76:00] could have also visited the sick. [76:09] I'm not this is not an attack on on on [76:12] the study of Torah 8 hours a day and [76:14] that and certainly doing that is better [76:16] than watching TV 8 hours a day or [76:18] practicing some forms of law. But uh the [76:23] uh [76:26] but uh but that is a very honest [76:29] question [76:31] and and that to me if you love man as [76:35] much as you love God, how is your ratio [76:40] so lopsided in serving God versus [76:44] serving man? Why is the ratio 10:1? [76:48] And anybody who argues that studying [76:50] Torah serves humanity is is arguing in a [76:55] mystical on a mystical basis that I just [76:57] can't relate to. In real terms, no other [77:01] humans are benefiting. [77:04] >> I understand what you're saying. The [77:07] people I'm talking about actually are [77:09] orthodox. I am not orthodox, but I am [77:12] fascinated with um [77:16] mids folks. And if we follow God's word, [77:21] he tells us that this is what we're [77:23] supposed to do as as we're learning that [77:26] we go out and perform. [77:28] >> Fine. She's saying for the record and [77:31] the microphone that uh [77:35] we are studying that one studies the [77:37] Torah, let's say to continue on in the [77:39] Jewish uh arena uh and that teaches you [77:42] how then to be better towards humans. I [77:45] agree with you. But my question remains [77:47] if the ratio of study to doing is 10 to [77:50] one, we have a problem. [77:54] And I mean it as a problem. This is not [77:56] an attack. I mean it as an actual I am [77:59] saying to you, I do believe that there [78:02] is a problem that there is a terrible [78:05] tension of loving God and loving man. I [78:08] am saying that to you. I'm not arguing [78:11] this uh uh to to make uh problems for [78:14] any group. I'm saying this is a [78:17] legitimate dilemma Moses is facing right [78:20] here. Said, "I see the suffering of the [78:22] people, so I am ticked off at you." [78:25] These are not loving words spoken to [78:27] God. You can Abraham spoke lovingly when [78:31] he argued with God. This is not loving. [78:34] He is angry at an evildoing God. Period. [78:39] You're stinking up the situation. Get me [78:42] out of it. [78:43] I'm angry at you and it is not the anger [78:46] of love. He may come later. He has love [78:49] later. Right now, this is not and I [78:52] understand that and so does every one of [78:54] you. [78:56] When you see pictures of Ashvitz or or [78:59] Rwanda or Bosnia or you name it, I it [79:04] does not fill you with love of God. It [79:06] doesn't make me an atheist but it [79:08] doesn't say hallelujah praise the lord [79:11] is not my reaction [79:14] which is why which is why you have to [79:18] however look the other way and the [79:21] interesting correlation [79:23] just as human evil gets you angry at God [79:26] or at least you you feel a gulf [79:30] human beauty and kindness makes you more [79:34] religious is [79:36] seeing beautiful human acts for the [79:40] religious per for me at any rate I'll [79:41] just speak for me brings me closer to [79:43] God. Ah now I understand that you've [79:46] created a creature in your image. Now I [79:49] understand what can be done when one [79:52] acts as you want us to. [79:56] It's it is an actual dilemma. And I [79:59] think that a lot of people in religion [80:01] in Islam, in the three monotheistic [80:04] faiths, Islam, Christianity, and Judaism [80:07] have uh have gone overboard in the love [80:12] of God and at a price. There is a price. [80:17] Not always. There are some people [80:18] intoxicated with love of God, [80:19] intoxicated love of man. They're the [80:21] best. Agreed. But for some, because if [80:25] you're not careful, it can easily [80:27] happen. [80:29] Listen, uh, you know, I'll give you a a [80:32] a not fully accurate analogy. [80:36] [clears throat] [80:37] How much time if you are if if you are a [80:40] married parent, how much time do you [80:42] spend with your spouse and how much with [80:45] your children? [80:49] I argue you can so love your children [80:52] that you can end up deflecting from your [80:55] love for your spouse. [80:59] And indeed less common but happens you [81:03] can so love your spouse your children [81:06] suffer neglect. [81:10] Love is not an you know it's not an it's [81:14] it theoretically it's an unlimited [81:16] commodity in feeling but it's not an [81:18] unlimited commodity in deed and and [81:21] frankly love of deed is more important [81:23] than love of feeling. [81:26] Well, then in that case it is very [81:29] important to know how you express that [81:31] love to really understand how much you [81:33] love. Oh, I love my wife and I check in [81:37] with her uh for 2 hours a week. [81:42] >> Well, that's, you know, it's an [81:44] interesting notion of love. [81:47] >> Yeah. [81:48] >> But loving people is loving God. [81:51] >> Loving people isn't loving God. Loving [81:53] people is doing what God wants us to do. [81:56] But I don't believe it is it is the same [81:58] >> expression of love. [81:59] >> It it could be an expression of love for [82:01] God. It isn't necessarily unless you [82:04] argue that there are no atheist can love [82:06] people. [82:11] And I'm sure that there are atheists who [82:13] love people. In fact, I know it. Yehuda [82:16] Bower has devoted his life. He is the [82:19] greatest one of the two three greatest [82:22] Holocaust historians of the world. He [82:24] has devoted his life to to the scholarly [82:28] pursuit of this horror. He's a member of [82:30] a kibbutz and a professor. He is an [82:33] atheist. I know him personally. He's one [82:35] of the most decent people I have ever [82:37] known in my life. If he were religious, [82:39] people would use him as an example of [82:41] the beauty of religiosity. [82:45] >> And he's not agnostic, atheist. Yes. [82:47] >> Why do you have to put the onus of evil [82:50] on God? I can separate what's happening [82:53] in this world from God. [82:55] >> Yes, you're right. Why? She asked. Why [82:57] do you put the onus of evil on God? You [82:59] can separate the evil in the world from [83:01] God. So could I. Otherwise, believe me, [83:03] I wouldn't uh I wouldn't be here today. [83:05] I'd be at a Halloween party. Uh the uh [83:10] but Moses is right. [83:12] You made it worse. [83:15] Moses absolutely correct here. There's [83:18] no separation. I did what you said and [83:20] now they're tortured. [83:22] >> Why does God play these games? [83:24] >> Hold on a sec. Yes. Yeah. [83:27] >> Well, there's also the theological [83:29] dilemma there [83:31] which isn't always practical [83:34] that if God is all and everything, he [83:37] then must take a share in that which [83:40] exists in the world. Ah, so your answer [83:43] to her is that in fact with all the evil [83:45] in the world, God is partially [83:47] responsible. He made the world. I I [83:51] think you're right. Uh [83:54] I [83:56] pro you're right providing you also [83:59] credit God with the good. You see, [84:01] here's where balance is critical. People [84:03] will say, "Look at all the evil. I blame [84:05] God." But then they don't give God [84:06] credit for all the good. It's almost [84:08] like you can only have a prosecutor but [84:10] no defense attorney for God. [84:11] >> Of course, that theological basis is the [84:14] justification for Moses's attack. [84:18] God must [84:19] >> well no no Moses's attack is is more [84:21] real than even you what you are just [84:23] saying God is the source of the evil [84:25] that just was increased to the Jews in [84:27] Egypt as directly you cannot say God is [84:31] the cause of Achvitz [84:33] okay God didn't cause that you could say [84:36] God caused it in so far as indirectly he [84:40] created a being that could enjoy uh [84:44] freezing human beings to [84:47] or stepping back, he is the cause of the [84:49] factor. [84:52] >> Well, he's But all right, but he's the [84:54] cause of the factor of Mother Teresa [84:56] picking up the dead in Kolkata, too. [84:58] That's what I'm saying. You're right. [85:00] That's why love is difficult of God. [85:02] Yes. [85:02] >> Isn't in plain language, isn't part of [85:05] the lesson here uh that faith requires [85:08] that we have a more long-sided view [85:10] rather than shortsided? And if Moses [85:13] could have looked ahead, he would have [85:15] enjoyed a greater faith because he knew [85:16] it was going to turn out okay anyway. [85:18] >> Good. I I I wish each word were recorded [85:21] that you said and I'm smiling because [85:24] you fell into a religious trap said is [85:27] doesn't faith require a long-term view? [85:32] Yeah, it requires a long-term view, but [85:34] if you take a long-term view, you end up [85:37] loving individuals living in the short [85:39] term much less. [85:41] I can't say to uh a Jew in Egypt who is [85:45] now uh literally dying of work. Listen, [85:48] in the long run, the Jews are going to [85:51] get out of here. You personally will be [85:53] whipped and beaten to death, but you [85:56] should feel really good knowing that in [85:58] the long run, he's going to come through [86:00] Jehovah. [86:03] I I in in all honesty, I there is some [86:05] truth to that. and to a truly believing [86:07] Jew uh and there and there certainly are [86:11] many uh and there were in Ashvitz. They [86:14] did go to the gas chamber uh singing the [86:16] shama. Uh there were too many instances [86:19] of this for this to be apocryphal and [86:21] they they did take the long term. this [86:24] Jewish people will outlive this Nazism [86:27] and certainly has uh and uh there was an [86:30] Israel and Germany was cut in half and [86:34] uh and Germany's name in the world for [86:37] uh as as one of the Nuremberg defendants [86:39] said will be will be a a an evil name or [86:42] associated with evil for generations and [86:45] it is and the Jews have their state and [86:48] I just got a letter from a uh a a German [86:51] girl of 17 years of age in Germany who [86:54] read my book on Judaism in uh in German [86:58] and is now converting to Judaism. And I [87:01] felt when I read it, that's revenge. [87:06] That you see, I have always felt not [87:08] buying Volkswagens was emotionally [87:11] cathartic but stupid. The real way to [87:14] get back is to convert Germany to [87:16] Judaism. [87:20] Agreed? [clears throat] [87:22] >> Yes. [87:24] wraps up if we have some sort of written [87:28] word that God up in Hitler's heart the [87:32] entire debate on whether or not evil [87:34] came because men did it manage it to man [87:38] or it was God who record [87:41] Moses is right God God did it correctly [87:45] he's strengthened Pharaoh's heart and [87:47] Moses wasn't that this was going to [87:49] happen God said it's going to take this [87:52] it's not going to by the way and I'm [87:54] going to have to show my sign. He never [87:56] said and by the way it's going to get a [87:58] lot worse for your people. [87:59] >> Good point. [88:00] >> Absolutely right. He had no clarity. Now [88:03] he's saying to God what what position [88:05] did you put me? You did this. You did it [88:08] right. Before you put me in position. [88:11] >> You're defending Moses's attack even [88:13] more than I was cuz I said God had a [88:15] legitimate answer. I told you he [88:17] wouldn't let them go. But you're right. [88:19] It isn't. You're right. Absolutely. [88:21] because he God didn't say it's going to [88:23] be worse. The specifics were not given [88:26] just that he won't let them out. Uh so [88:29] it's it's semillegitimate. But your your [88:31] point it makes it makes it correctly. [88:33] It's a valid sharpening of Moses's [88:36] attack. [88:37] >> Moses is right in the fact that God [88:38] actually did it. Not just that [88:40] >> that Oh yeah, I said that. Yeah. I said [88:42] God did it right. As opposed to Ashitz. [88:44] God did it. [88:48] >> That's right. [88:49] >> Yes, it is. I I'm with you. That's why [88:53] that's why I mean I suspect that all of [88:57] you or nearly all of you are familiar [88:59] with Abraham's arguing with God if there [89:01] are 50 righteous or of God wanting to [89:05] destroy the Jews and Moses arguing. For [89:08] some reason, these two verses [89:11] just don't get any attention. And I [89:15] consider them the most radical verses of [89:17] the Bible. [89:19] They speak to us today so directly. This [89:24] is what we would ask. [89:28] Not 50. Wow. What if there are 50 [89:30] righteous people in Japan? You know, [89:32] will you still drop the bomb? Which is [89:34] an interesting philosophical question. [89:36] This is directed at God directly. You're [89:39] the cause of evil. I'm sick of this. Get [89:42] me out of this. [89:44] And God, you will see. Uh so it does [89:48] work out perfectly. Ending chapter 5, [89:50] you will see God finds the question [89:53] legitimate. He actually enters a [89:56] defensive mode. [89:59] That is what is so fascinating about the [90:02] next chapter's beginning. [90:05] You're right. God doesn't say the words [90:07] you're right, but doesn't have to. The [90:10] God that you are yelling at, God will [90:13] say, is not the God you know. [90:19] to a certain extent it's not the God [90:21] that we know [90:25] cuz except that can a Jew today say that [90:28] God keeps his long-term where's my [90:31] long-term friend long-term promises see [90:34] that's the difficulty [90:37] on the one hand the the resurrection of [90:40] a Jewish state argues incredibly [90:44] uniquely for faith there There is no [90:46] parallel to this on this planet. [90:48] Correct? Prophecies coming true,000 [90:51] years later after people should have [90:53] died out. No other people got dispersed [90:55] and stayed alive and then resurrected [90:57] itself. On the other hand, [91:02] was it worth all the suffering of 2,000 [91:05] years of diaspora jewelry? Was it worth [91:08] the Holocaust? Was it worth the [91:10] Inquisition? Was it worth the Crusades? [91:13] >> Not for us to know. for us to have faith [91:15] that God might think that. [91:17] >> Yes, I fully agree with you. He says, I [91:20] fully theologically, not humanly agree. [91:23] He says it's not for us to know. It's [91:25] only for us to know that God does have a [91:29] system here. [91:31] This itself raises a tremendous [91:34] interesting question which I won't [91:35] answer because I don't have an answer. I [91:38] grew up orthodox and I'm very happy I [91:41] did. [91:44] And it was a given [91:47] that every Jew in the Middle Ages who [91:50] died rather than converted to [91:52] Christianity when that was their choice, [91:55] accept Christ or be killed was a was a [91:59] martyr who died sanctifying God's name. [92:02] And if and they were they were martyrs [92:04] who died sanctifying God's name. I [92:06] accept that totally. It's a fact. [92:11] When I had my first child, [92:15] I saw them differently. [92:17] [clears throat] [92:20] When as a single young man, martyrdom [92:24] may was just clearly the option to take. [92:29] If somebody said to me today, accept X [92:32] or we kill your family, I don't know [92:34] what I would do. And I am a deeply [92:37] believing Jew. [92:39] But am I going to say, "Oh, sure. Kill [92:41] my wife, me and my children. Me, I can [92:44] handle me. Yeah, I know. I know my [92:48] principles are pretty inviolent. I'll [92:50] die. [92:52] My my wife and kids, I'm going to give [92:55] their lives up [music] for this for the [92:58] long-term view." [93:01] I'm agnostic on that question. [93:05] >> God. [93:06] >> No. Well, yes. I guess to use the the [93:09] framework that I've put it in [93:16] one other way of putting it might be I [93:18] would be hating the the the people [93:22] [music] [93:23] I would be saying [93:27] there are things more important than [93:29] life. [93:30] Not so much I'm loving God more than my [93:33] family. [music] Mm-m. [93:37] If I spent all my time [music] [93:40] studying Torah and neglecting my kids, I [93:43] could say I have chosen God over [music] [93:44] my family. But give up what you believe [93:47] in. Live a life that you don't believe [93:50] in for the sake of keeping your pe your [93:53] family alive as inauthentic people is a [93:57] different question. on tomorrow's Sunday [94:00] fireside chat. [94:01] >> I was in the Soviet Union at the age of [94:03] 21. I was sent in to smuggle things in [94:07] and smuggle things out [94:09] because of my knowledge of Russian and [94:12] other reasons. And anyway, I I so I [94:17] I became aware although I was even [94:20] before I went of what totalitarianism is [94:24] at a very very young age. So let me tell [94:27] you something. This is not new. When I [94:30] came back to the US [94:33] and I I started lecturing immediately [94:36] started a very young age of 21 people [94:39] would invite me. Young man just came [94:41] back from the Soviet Union. You know, [94:42] nobody knew the name Dennis Prager, of [94:44] course. But I I was sort of somewhat of [94:48] a collector's item having been in the [94:50] Soviet Union and what was it like? And I [94:52] and I knew how to speak. So I got these [94:55] speeches [94:57] and after about a year maybe even less [95:00] but uh let's say a year I actually would [95:04] say in my lectures [95:06] ladies and gentlemen [95:10] it is uh clear it is clear to me [95:14] that [95:16] speaking to people living in freedom [95:19] about totalitarianism [95:22] means very Little [95:24] >> join us tomorrow to hear more [music] on [95:26] timeless wisdom with Dennis Prager. [95:29] Visit dennisprager.com for thousands of [95:32] hours of Dennis's lectures, courses, and [95:34] classic radio programs and to purchase [95:36] [music] Dennis Prager's Rational Bibles. [95:42] We want to take just a second to thank [95:44] the team at Life Audio for their [95:46] partnership with us on the podcast. Go [95:48] to lifeaudio.com to find dozens of other [95:50] faith- centered podcasts in their [95:52] network, including shows about prayer, [95:54] Bible study, parenting, and more. [95:57] >> When someone you love is hurting, what [95:59] do you do? We're often quick to say, "If [96:01] there's anything I can do, just let me [96:03] know." [music] But what if we stopped [96:05] waiting to be asked and simply showed [96:07] up? On the If There is Anything I Can Do [96:10] podcast, Pam McConnell shares real [96:12] stories, [music] biblical wisdom, and [96:14] practical ways to walk alongside people [96:16] through grief, loss, and life's hardest [96:18] moments. Learn how to show up and make a [96:20] difference. Subscribe [music] now at [96:22] klopppodcast.com, [96:24] YouTube, or wherever you listen to [96:26] podcasts.
